I empathize greatly with the letter writer who is looking for a mate who is intellecutally curious. I'm a 31 year old man (in shape, decently attractive from what I've been told) who loves to learn, debate good-heartedly, and be challenged on a regular basis. I love history, literature, politics, science (PhD in biology), international affairs, the arts, etc, and I would love to find someone with whom I can share these interests. However, finding that lady is a chore.

I've been out with numerous women - many with graduate or professional degrees - over the past several years and only once have I found someone truly intellectually curious, patient, and challenging. Most everyone else, although usually quite intelligent, is so self-absorbed and incurious it knocks me for a loop. I soon learn that the few "scholarly" things that they seem able to converse about are either 1) directly related to their education/career and/or 2) pancake thin in depth. It's hard not to laugh when someone tells you she follow politics closely and then you learn she can't even name the senators who represent her. They also seem unable to have a conversation of any length unless the topic repeatedly relates back to something they have personally experienced (boy does that get dull in a hurry!).

Sorry about venting here, but it's not often I read something online (or anywhere else for that matter) that addresses this issue which seems to plague what seems to be a very small, but, I hope, vigourous contingent of people in this country.

Do you think perhaps it might have more to do with the fact that the art of conversation is slowly being lost in this country? how many families still have dinner together and discuss current events or politics? how many people go to social functions and have real conversations that don't involve american idol or big brother? i think maybe the problem is that we don't know how to converse with one another anymore....

Scholar,

From what I hear, women are really starting to overake men in fields that require the use of the ol' gray matter- sciences etc. One anecdotal example- My wife is in pharmacy school and the majority (albeit slight) of the students are women.

Scholar,

From what I hear, women are really starting to overake men in fields that require the use of the ol' gray matter- sciences etc. One anecdotal example- My wife is in pharmacy school and the majority (albeit slight) of the students are women.

Scholar,

From what I hear, women are really starting to overake men in fields that require the use of the ol' gray matter- sciences etc. One anecdotal example- My wife is in pharmacy school and the majority (albeit slight) of the students are women.

"i think maybe the problem is that we don't know how to converse with one another anymore.... "

That's what you get when you have a technically over stimulated and under educated society!

let's talk about me."

Yes, a lot of us are self-absorbed these days. I divide this into two groups. One are people who mistake putting themselves at the center of attention with actually doing something interesting. The other are people consumed by some passion who, either accidentally or on purpose, forget about life outside their heads. I'm sometimes guilty of both!

As far as intellectual curiosity goes, it takes real courage to admit you don't know a damn thing about a subject. And the more you learn about anything, the more you realize you don't know about everything. The worst are canned responses. I'd rather not have an opinion on something than rehash someone else's

I'm so glad to hear that someone else sympathizes with the LW. It's not a case of either having a great, caring, illiterate guy who doesn't care about culture or an educated, self-impressed asshole who likes all the right books.

And I certainly sympathize with you, sweetscholar, as you seem to be one of the few people here so far who understands how wonderful it would be to have an intellectually stimulating partner. I am wondering how you choose women to go out with? Perhaps if you met people through common interest groups or political volunteering they would be more likely to share your interests. It's easy to write on a dating website "I love politics", but the ones who really do are out campaigning.

I agree with Clara and sweetscholar. Having someone who shares your curiosity and desire to explore the world as a life partner is a wonderful thing. My husband is a wonderful, caring man, a great listener and intellectually curious and engaged to boot. We don't share all the same interests, but we are excited to learn from and about each other's. It makes life together a great deal of fun.

Intellectual curiosity seems to be an extremely rare thing among both men and women. I am an older married professional, but the thing I notice most about my peers is that no one ever talks about reading anything, let alone literature. Worse, people with degrees and professional designations want to talk about television shows. Political discussion in my part of the world is touchy since I work for politicians. Any talk about history or science is likely to be received with a blank (dumb foreigner) stare.

But give it some time. You'll eventually find someone that wants to talk about something you are interested in.

If this woman had said that her beau was perfect in every way except (there it is again!) he was boring in bed, I doubt if the advice would have been to settle on this almost-perfect guy and just plan on getting her licks on with someone else later as a way to fill in the gap (no pun intended).

All she's basically saying is, something is missing, for me in this relationship, can I live with that? It depends on how much she values the missing component and it sounds like she values this a lot. Why do people insist on square-pegging themselves into round holes?

Clara wrote the following post at 02/14/2008 3:23 PM:

"I am wondering how you choose women to go out with?"

Similarly, how selective (read: picky) are you regarding other aspects of the women you choose to date? Are you willing to overlook a less-than-ideal physique for a keen and curious mind?

Also, when passionately debating a given subject, is it possible you come across as judgmental and self-aggrandizing, leading your potential paramours, perhaps, to ponder the purpose of participating in this palaver?

While I know that the search for a compatible person can be arduous, I can't help wondering if the way you are defining "scholarly" is hampering your search. I consider myself fortunate to have friends and co-workers who are intelligent and well-rounded (by my totally biased standards - some also by societal markers such as advanced degrees, career success, etc, and some not). I notice that one characteristic shared by the individuals I consider the most intellectually engaging is a tendency to be inclusive. They do not consider a conversation about television to be less of an opportunity for debate than a conversation about literature, recognizing that both are ways of storytelling. They do not draw strict boundaries around what is worthy of intellectual debate and what is not, having learned from history that one generation's pop culture is another's classical studies. And they recognize stories from personal experience as gateways to discover what other individuals are passionate and curious about, and how others see and interact with the world. Not to discount your experiences, which sound disappointing, but it seems to me that being intellectually curious includes wanting to learn about new topics, not just rehashing what you already know. You want to find someone to share your interests - what about her interests?

(I'm the original LW - please see my post if interested in sharing your experiences.)

I think tea_drinker's post is instructive for my particular situation. I don't think it's necessarily important that romantic partners share every interest - in fact, that could get boring in a hurry. What's more important is the urge to hold any cultural object (television, trends, high art, low art, you name it) up for scrutiny - to laugh at it, maybe, or to use it as a touchstone for larger issues.

With Mr. (QP) R, I think I need to be alert to opportunities to do this - to find ways to connect in *observing* experiences, rather than in the experiences themselves.

Scholar,

Too bad all the women you've taken out are so dreadfully boring, with their "pancake-thin" intellects. When everyone in your world seems stupid and bothersome, check if the problem isn't you.

I've found that with the vast majority of people, it's possible to have a very interesting conversation by practicing a genuine interest in other people, especially the ones different from yourself. Draw out someone's opinions or experiences in a friendly way and you'll be surprised by the interesting things that almost everyone has to say.

When everyone around you seems stupid, ask if maybe you're always rubbing people the wrong way or making them feel uncomfortable or inadequate. Recently, on the job, my most difficult customer of the week (belligerent, obtuse, rude, impatient) was trying to purchase a book called "How To Deal With Difficult People." All I could think of was the irony, and that to this dude, everyone in the world is being difficult.