Mr Saletan said: “Nearly half of the male-to-female transsexuals in a small study say they've achieved postoperative orgasm.”

What is your fascination with how others have sex? Was it necessary to put that line in bold? And your fascination with people born transsexual? As Adept42 said on another thread in you’re objectifying us and dehumanizing us.

Mr Saletan further said: “All the participants had feminizing genitoplasty, i.e., "their penis surgically removed, their urethra repositioned and female labia constructed."

I know that’s a quote from this study you’re squawking about, BUT again you’re focusing on the surgery again. It’s an unhealthy focus if you ask me. You totally don’t get what being born transsexual is about. It’s about gender stupid! I was born this way. It has affected every freaking waking moment of my life. Being treated as something you’re not is a soul crushing experience that can’t be put into words. Thank God I can transition so that my outside matches the inside AND as a result people now see the real me. Transition saves lives. And yet you are always focused on sex and THE operation. You are a NOT educating anybody. You are a voyeur who likes to objectify members of a tiny minority.

“Most patients were happy with the surgery.”

Well duh! The person finally is congruent, that is their brain and body now match. Something that by the way you take for granted. Some of us can NEVER take it for granted.

“Human Nature's prediction: The next (but much rarer) breakthrough procedure will be adding a vagina while keeping your penis.”

Ummm NO! How insulting! I can’t believe you were stupid enough to even print that. That comment show a complete disregard for what transsexualism is about. I was born with a female gender identity and a male body. After decades of turmoil I have finally overcome the shame and denial I have fixed my birth condition. That’s what transition is about: being whole (in mind,body and spirit) and being recognized as the gender/person you are. Read “True Selves” by Mildred Brown and get a sense of what we go through.

It’s not about sex. It’s about gender stupid!

To be fair, YOU might want to be exclusively female, but another person might like to have both a penis and a vagina. (Whether the shrinks would let them have it is another issue). As I'm sure you know, gender identity is not an either/or thing. Different things are right for different people.

The problem is Mr Saletan didn't present it that way. He presented is as though this is something a person born transsexual wants. By definition a person born transsexual wants to be seen as there proper gender (male or female) and NOT something in between. That would be an androgyne or genderqueer. But instead throguh his ignorance, Mr Saletan conflates these issues. Again a person born transsexual is VERY sure of their gender. The thought of having both a vagina and a penis is quite offensive to us. You seem to be just as confused as Mr Saletan and this is a continuing problem for our community: People who have no idea of what they are talking about thinking the are experts. You all focus on THE suurgery (and only the MtF one at that) and sex. You completely ignore the life of pain and misery we have endured. You don't see how we are disowned by our family, shunned by our churches, fired by our employers, divorced by our spouses and more. How we struggl;e on a daily basis to just survive nevermind transition. Lucky ones like me manage it, many don't. But you don't see any of that and, for all intents and purposes, objectivize and sexualize us. Go to http://www.LynnConway.com and educate yourself. That is an extensive, truthful explanation of our experience. You ignore our struggle and pain. You are NOT an expert. I am because I live it everyday. Case closed!

Obviously, you speak for all transgendered, xrk9854 ("case closed"). You should be divorced by your spouses, BTW, if you have misrepresented yourself. Anyhoo, based on your posts, I have no sympathy for your plight. In fact, if transgendered issues are attached to homosexual ones, I will have to be against those as well. You are so shrill, so single-minded and so combative that I will work tirelessly to ensure that your are driven back to cellar of the unredemptively defective.

I only appeared combative to close minded people like yourself. It's clear you are a cultural conservative. You're one of those people who deny reality.

Guess what? Homosexuality exists and is a natural state of being for some people. Any expert will tell you people are born heterosexual, homosexual, bisexual or asexual. Given it is a natural state of being how can you be against that? What do you fear?

Guess what? People born transsexual exist as well. However, our issue is gender, not sexuality. But close minded people like you are ignorant of that and conflate us with people who are gay.

You give me the impression that you are an essentialist, that you believe everyone should fit into 2 little neat boxes. Either heterosexual male and heterosexual female. Life is much, much more complicated than that Rampart. Nature loves diversity, society (specifically people like you) abhors it. Open your mind Rampart.

What has my marital staus have to do with this?

I did not misrepresent myself. That is a oversimplication. People did make assumptions about me. The doctor declared me male because that is what I appeared to be. My parents raised me as a boy because that is what I appeared to be. Society saw a male and treated me as such. Nobody saw the real me! However, that identity never was right for me. It felt wrong and foreign to me. I lacked the language to convey my feelings and did my best to please other people. Finally it got to a point where I discovered others like me and learned the language that I lacked. I have transitioned an now my life makes sense. People see the real me and my life is authentic. I fit in. Words fail to explain the experience.

If you want to know more you can read "True Selves" by Mildred Brown.

Rampart you seek to condemn what you don't understand. Why don't you do some research first. You might find that you are wrong. But maybe that's your problem, you can't admit that you're wrong. Because that would mean you are ignorant and a bigot.

Judge not Rampart lest ye be judged.

Rampart said:"I have no sympathy for your plight. In fact, if transgendered issues are attached to homosexual ones, I will have to be against those as well. You are so shrill, "

You probably are the kind of person who spoke in favor of:

Laws prohibiting inter-racial marriage

Institutionalized segregation, so called "separate but equal"

Not allowing women to vote

Slavery

Think the world is flat

That the sun is the center of the universe etc etc....

Face it you're the type that doesn't like progress. I hate to tell you your kind always loses. You think the world should conform to you and your beliefs. The world is a much more complicated place than you believe and pretending it's not makes you look delusional.

I'm not looking for the world to conform to my beliefs. I only want the SAME civil rights that you already have. According to the founding fathers we are all created equal. And over the last 200+ plus years we the people have strived to make that principle a reality. I work in healthcare and I treat all my patients the same. It doesn't matter whether they be white, black, hispanic, Chinese, gay, Mormon or whatever. All people are due simple basic "inalienable rights", as the founding father called them. Life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. And yet you, and people like you, want to keep me and others like me (GLBT), oppressed because we don't measure up to YOUR standards. That's not what America is about Rampart. America is about diversity and it's this same diversity that makes this country great.

I'm different. So what? I don't like you either, but I respect your right to exist. But with you lacking that basic respect for me (and GLBT people in general) it's hard to have a converstion with you. When I ask for basic human respect I am not being "shrill".

Oops! My bad. I meant to write:

That you think the Earth is the center of the universe.

Which reminds me. Did you know Gallileo was put under house arrest and threatened with excommunication for teaching against that belief? The Catholic Church considered it an assault on their beliefs. Of course the Church was proven wrong, but the Church waited over 500 years before lifting it's condemnation of Gallileo. Talk about being slow to change. Rampart the point is religions make mistakes. Judging by your statement about gays I think you're blindly following a religious dogma that was taught to you. Now don't get me wrong, I'm a christian myself and believe in love, forgiveness and tolerance. My faith is not about judging or condemning others. Sometimes in earthly matters we must use some common sense in order to catch ourselves from falling into the trap of judging others. By strictly adhering to some dogma you're absolving yourself of any personal responsibility for your actions. There is no such thing as hate or discrimination in the name of the Lord.