Why are we trading with communist China? I mean aside from the fact that we apparently love nations that use slave wage labor, forced child labor and that they refuse to consider any type of environmental laws. What other reasons are we using to explain our love affair with cheap Chinese products. Is it because they like killing any Chinese citizen who speaks of freedom and Democracy?

Perhaps we have granted China most favored nation status because of things like this:

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Please examine everything in the article as it mentions the communist governments complicity. See also the side bar that shows part of the unarmed American plane that China knocked out of the sky just 3 months after GWB was elected. In fact the complete inept handling of that situation broadcast to the entire about world how our future foreign policy would be played by that administration, everything headed straight into the toilet shortly after.

The major point of the article was not about the unarmed American plane the communist Chinese knocked from the sky, it was about what is happening in 2009. October to be exact, right now to be precise. The Communist Chinese are waging an ongoing cyber war against the sovereign United States of America. They are stealing military and technical secrets from where ever they can, and for those who think it is no big deal or that it doesn't matter so long as they can buy a cheap telephone or a 2 dollar T shirt please remember this: China has on going military and energy deals with Iran. China also has close ties with North Korea and has always helped that nation with its military technology. China also wants its currency to replace the US dollar as the official international unit of money.

So next time you walk into a store and pretend it does not matter if you are buying products made in a communist country that has zero respect for the lives of human beings remember what China is, and that is not a friend of freedom. Remember that it is your Wal-Mart money buying missile technology for Iran and North Korea. It is your money building the military that openly admits training to fight a direct war against the United States of America.

So tell me again, why are we trading with these communists?

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P.S. It was an article in the Slatest that led to the WSJ piece.

no one believes sanctions will work. Perhaps because most believe economic globalization will have political impact within China. Perhaps people think that not only will sanctions not work - they will eliminate reforms and cause general harm to the population.

Aside from that your forensic analysis on purchases of Chinese goods is more than suspect.

political Messiah WANTS us to trade with mainland China?

Why should a liberal care what China does to its citizens anyway? You DO know that many of Obama's administrators routinely quote excerps from Chairman Mao's little red book, right? Oh . . . no . . . you WOULDN'T be aware of that fact because being a good liberal means that you never watch Fox News and so you don't get to see those video segments featuring various Obama officials doing just that.

But don't fret. Thanks first to Bush and now to Obama's heroic financial savy in sinking up so deeply into debt that we might never climb out of that hole, mainland China is now our primary creditor. They HAVE to be our best pal because if we default on our loans then not only will we plunge the world into a massive economic depression but we will probably destroy both mainland China and ourselves in the process.

Life is good.

What have the communists changed since we handed them our successful economy on a silver platter?

How has the nation with the largest military in the world moderated its posture since the advent of globalization?

For that matter what has been the basic result for the middle class and working class in the sovereign United States since the advent of "globalization"?

Are you implying that China does not use the money it gains from its unfair trade practices to engage in cyber warfare against the United States? Or are you simply suggesting that the murderers controlling the communist government will someday start singing kumbaya around the campfire spontaneously as a result of simply closing all of our manufacturing plants and handing the strongest economy the world had ever seen directly to a communist government that happily murders its own citizens in the street?

Have you spent years popping stupid pills?

The guy asks a question - now I readily admit it wasn't particularly well thought out - but my god, you've dumbed it down with stupidity.

Why should a liberal care, you ask? What's it got to do with anything? The Republicans have a stronger record on closer ties with China than do Democrats. Think about Nixon. Bush sr. was in office during the Tiananmen Square massacres and merely suspended "military" sales and visits. Oooh.

Where exactly do you think Obama falls out of line with every other President in your lifetime? Where do you think he's wrong, on China?

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What have the communists changed since we handed them our successful economy on a silver platter?

We (meaning "you") didn't do that. So, your question doesn't make sense. But for the record, much has changed in China. Start with Hong Kong and go from there.

How has the nation with the largest military in the world moderated its posture since the advent of globalization?

The obvious answer is in agreeing to multi-party talks with the U.S. and other nations on North Korea. They've also taken progressively small but important steps in pressuring North Korea toward peace talks and pressuring them against the use of atomic weapons. That's the first thing that comes to mind.

For that matter what has been the basic result for the middle class and working class in the sovereign United States since the advent of "globalization"?

ummmmm- First, globalization has been a force since......... forever. Second - let's see - cheaper better goods, and therefore more disposable income. And until this recession hit unemployment hadn't cost any jobs - so there wasn't an obvious downside. At the same time, as the Chinese economy has grown, it has allowed for American and other nation's companies a superb opportunity for investment.

Are you implying that China does not use the money it gains from its unfair trade practices to engage in cyber warfare against the United States?

First, are you implying it is the Chinese government that is making these goods you are trying not to buy? Second, I'm sure Chinese trade practices are often unfair. But once in a while American trade practices are unfair too - even with its closest allies. Third - cyber warfare against the U.S.?

Or are you simply suggesting that the murderers controlling the communist government will someday start singing kumbaya around the campfire spontaneously as a result of simply closing all of our manufacturing plants and handing the strongest economy the world had ever seen directly to a communist government that happily murders its own citizens in the street?

Lay off the hard stuff. <link>

I had thought someone who claims to make intelligent posts would reply with a bit more intelligence. I don't know why I expected a coherent reply from you but I did.

My bad... One day I'll remember that you are incapable of intelligent conversation..

I will you give you my house and my vehicles if you find one post where I ever claimed Obama to be a messiah? Just one. So either prove it or shut the f#ck up about it.

Your love tango with the trolls here have made you even worse than you were before.

From Reagan forward our trade policies with China have been an absolute joke. EVERY president since that time has sold out the working class and middle class of America with regards to that murderous nation. I expected better from Obama and his entire administration. He campaigned on better trade policies and its time to hold hid feet to the fire with regards to his words on the issue. And that will be done away from this board for obvious reasons.

If we destroy the communist Chinese government by defaulting on our loans there then I say GOOD. We pay everyone else but I could care less if that nation returns to its agrarian roots. They were quite happy as agrarians until our nations gloabl capitalists decided they enjoy employing slaves.

why anyone would want to trade with a large, aggressive nation that spies on other countries.

Why would anyone want to trade with China?

Why would anyone want to trade with Russia?

Why would anyone want to trade with the United States?

Why would any country want to trade with any other country?

Let us known when you learn the answer Nick.

Who knows, maybe that doesn't concern you.

But it should.

the United States has foolishly been the most open market in the history of modern industry. let us not forget that our nation has allowed others to cheat and dump their products here for decades while our own industries have been shuttered and millions of our own citizens living standards driven to 2nd world status.

Sure a few globalists have made themselves stinking rich while selling out the American populace but the vast majority of the people living here have lost very, very much. I am not xenophobic, and have no problems with nations that have humane labor laws. China does not have humane labor laws.

Why would anyone love to trade with America? They all do because our politicians have been complete fools who open our markets to nations who keep theirs closed or barely accessable.

Did you not write a few years back that you earn a handsome bit of money from trade with the communists in China? Or was that someone else?

they sell us stuff we want to buy at prices we want to pay.

I never said I made any money off the Chinese Communists. I don't make any money off the Chinese Communists.

I said that some of my relatives were Chinese Communists.

Kira strongly disagreed with my take on communist China. He did so firmly but politely, I may have responded a bit forcefully but I did not belittle the poster nor did I try to tell him/her that I was so much smarter about 17 times in one post. If I start doing that then yes I would be like the poster who calls himself gatewood and demcon and cicero. And yes that would concern me.

Yes, many Americans are too short sighted to see how much that 7 dollar pair of jeans really cost. I do not hate people who happen to be Chinese. I do hate the government there and the business practices there, the human rights policies there, the ecological policies there, and the foriegn policies there.

Trading with that nation in the current circumstances is pure stupidity on the part of any American who wants to maintain any semblance to the standards of living we have today. If one thinks reviving the conditons that existed in the United States during the later part of the 1880's through the 1890's is a good thing, then by all means we should continue our current course. Myself, I think I'll fight it.

So I'll specify what triggered my reaction:

Or are you simply suggesting that the murderers controlling the communist government will someday start singing kumbaya around the campfire spontaneously as a result of simply closing all of our manufacturing plants and handing the strongest economy the world had ever seen directly to a communist government that happily murders its own citizens in the street?

Very, VERY Gatewoodian both in terms of hyperbole to the point of reckless disregard for whether what's claimed is actually, ya know, true; and (duh!) the juvenile kumbaya nonsense.