Dear Prudence and the Jacket Response
by Camacho
10/12/2009, 9:36 AM #
As a working mother, I thought I should offer up an alternative point of view for the mother who's child becomes hysterical when she attempts to put his jacket on in the morning....I noted that this occurs when the child is getting ready for daycare; perhaps Mom and Dad should look a bit more closely at what's going on in daycare (it is entirely possible that there is some stress inducing situation happening that a 3 year old simply cannot verbalize). It might be a good idea to take a day and sit in and observe a typical day for their 3 year old. Alternatively, if the day care situation seems to check out, it could simply be a bout of separation anxiety; maybe Mom and Dad should take a look at how much time they're actually spending with their child in the course of a normal day or work week. I know from experience that it's difficult to balance work and parenting along with everything else going on in a person's life and sometimes, we simply are unaware that what we perceive as quality time is, in a child's perspective, simply not time enough.
BTW, I absolutely love this column.
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Re: Dear Prudence and the Jacket Response
by PiquePlace
10/12/2009, 10:31 AM #
I realize I'm raising a controversial opinion, but it breaks my heart that a 3 YO is being carted off to daycare and I wish Prudie would have also offered the suggestion that the couple examine if there isn't a way to re-work their schedules and/or re-work their finances so the child doesn't have to go to daycare.
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Re: Dear Prudence and the Jacket Response
by IncogNeato
10/12/2009, 10:59 AM #
I was wondering when your ilk would come crawling out of the woodwork.
You want controversy? Try this. There is no harm in sending a kid to daycare. None. Nada. Zero. Zip.
I went to daycare and am now a reasonably well-adjusted and very intelligent adult. I never felt unloved because I got to go play with other kids on playground equipment and learn songs and draw pictures and such every day. Had I remained at home, I'd have been given a doll or something to play with while my mother mopped, sewed, cooked and did all the other things parents do who stay home all day. At least, all the parents who don't sit at home getting drunk or watching TV or chatting on the phone (or now computer) all day.
Do you really think children in previous generations, when daycare was a rarity, got to stay home and play with Mommy all day? They either worked - in the fields, churning butter, delivering newspapers, tending younger siblings, etc. - or they were sent off to see another relative or friend so Mommy would have time to do all the things parents had to do before prepackaged foods, vacuum cleaners, ready-made clothing, and all that. Or they were left to their own devices in approximate earshot of Mom, while she did what needed to be done.
The greatest argument you could make against daycare is that some children are injured or molested or killed in daycares. Guess what? Children are also harmed or molested or killed at home. If the parents would both be really happier spending their days with other adults and doing something challenging and intellectually rewarding, isn't the child better off spending a few hours in the eveings and all weekend with those parents, than the child who is stuck home all day with a parent who pines to be anywhere else, doing anything else than wiping snotty noses and reading Dr. Seuss all day?
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Re: Dear Prudence and the Jacket Response
by dumb_blonde
10/12/2009, 11:12 AM #
I was a stay at home mom for 5 years. My kids didn't go to day care, but I really think they would have been better prepared for school, interacting with other kids & adjusting to a structured environment if they did go to daycare. They wen't exposed to common childhood illnesses & had a weaken immune system when they did start school.
As a stay at home mom, I became emotionaly involved with General Hospital, so much that I began to think it was real. I was so hungry for adult interaction, my brain felt dead, I didn't know how to talk to other adults at dinner parties/gatherings.I didn't know the hot topics of the day, politics, news, fashion, but I could tell you what letter was featured on Sesame Street. I had nothing in common with adults, none of them knew who Steve & Jessie were, none of them cared that Luke & Laura got married.
My self esteem was zero, when the kids started school & I decided to get a job, I convinced myself that I could do nothing more then work at a fast food. None of this was at fault of hubby, it was just spending the majority of my time with kids vs adults.
If I could do it all over again, I would have at least taken on a part time job & had the kids in daycare part time.
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Re: Dear Prudence and the Jacket Response
by PiquePlace
10/12/2009, 11:29 AM #
dumb_blonde, had you not heard of MOPS, or Mother's Day Out, or the countless other groups and activities that are available out there that help you and your children interact with other grownups and children? It's sad that you weren't aware of those opportunities, they may have helped you from feeling so isolated.
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Re: Dear Prudence and the Jacket Response
by PiquePlace
10/12/2009, 11:31 AM #
IncogNeato, Wow, talk about a knee jerk reaction! Calm down.
You say there is Nada Zero Zip harm in sending a kid to daycare. And you
base that statement on your experience, and that's wonderful that your experience
was not harmful, but there are studies that find otherwise.
Yes, I know, there are also other studies that say it's fine, but given the
choice between being watched by strangers or being watched by mommy, I would
wager the majority of children would choose mommy, even if she is sewing,
mopping, or cooking. Mothers engage their children in the day-to-day activities
so your argument that you'd have been given a doll and ignored is weak,
although if that's how your parents were, my sympathies.
I realize that not everyone can stay home with their children, that there
are financial hardships that require children being sent to daycare, but too
often these days people confuse "standard of living" with
"standard of luxury". That is why I merely suggested the couple might
examine if their standards could be re-worked so that the child, 3 years old no
less, wouldn't have to be sent to daycare. The coat issue could be due to the
fact that the child doesn't want to go.
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Re: Dear Prudence and the Jacket Response
by dumb_blonde
10/12/2009, 11:53 AM #
This was over 25 years ago. in a itty bitty little town. Most women there worked. there wasn't those types of networking at that time there.
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Re: Dear Prudence and the Jacket Response
by PiquePlace
10/12/2009, 12:01 PM #
Yeah, I would imagine 25 years ago resources were more limited. That's a shame. I hope things are better for you now in relation to your self-esteem and work situation.
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Re: Dear Prudence and the Jacket Response
by donnamp
10/12/2009, 1:11 PM #
Didn't realize that people who think that it might be beneficial for a child for a parent to stay home with them are vermin who crawl out of the woodwork.
I was a stay at home mom until my ex injured himself and couldn't work for years. My children were already in school when I went back to work. My children did not suffer in any way from not going to day care and were as well adjusted and intelligent as their counterparts that did go to daycare. They had friends in the neighborhood who were not in day care and had social interaction with others. We spent time doing things with our children, playing games, reading to them, taking them places and teaching them the things that they needed to learn to start kindergarten. We were involved in activities where our children would have interaction with other kids while we interacted with other adults. If our houses weren't immaculate, so be it. Most of the time our major housework would get done when the kids would all get together to play at one or the others house, when they were napping or when our husbands got home and spent time with the kids. We never got into soap operas or talk shows, getting drunk or talking on the phone all day. My girls had paper routes (you seem to think there is something wrong with that from your comment) not to get them out of our hair but to teach them how to be responsible and how to handle money. They were totally responsible for their routes during the week but on the weekends my ex and I would get up early with them and help them. The time that I spent with my children was challenging, stimulating and in my opinion intellectually rewarding. I taught them the things that they needed to learn to be responsible productive adults. Now they are both in their 20's and they are productive hard working adults that I am very proud of. My one daughter doesn't want children and that is her choice, my other daughter does want children but does not think that she will want to be a stay at home mom and that is her choice. I chose to be a stay at home mom and I don't regret one single minute of the time that I spent with my children.
So really, how much of that time in the evenings and on the weekends does the career parent actually spend with the kids? Don't they have to come home and do the same chores that the stay at home mom does during the day, even if they are shared by both partners? Don't they ever need to wind down after a long grueling day (week) at work?
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Re: Dear Prudence and the Jacket Response
by PiquePlace
10/12/2009, 1:38 PM #
donnamp:So really, how much of that time in the evenings and on the weekends does the career parent actually spend with the kids? Don't they have to come home and do the same chores that the stay at home mom does during the day, even if they are shared by both partners? Don't they ever need to wind down after a long grueling day (week) at work?
donnamp, excellent point!!! One that I overlooked from IncogNeato's argument. All
anger stems from one form of fear or another and IncogNeato had such an
angry outburst at my opposing opinion (one that I tried to voice
respectfully) it makes me wonder what she is so afraid of. Her argument
that children are better off in what really amounts to an
institutionalized environment such as daycare versus at home with a
parent just doesn't hold water. I'm guessing there is more going on
with IncogNeato and her experiences with daycare and parenting. I wish
her well. As to your question about the time in the evenings and on the weekends that career parents actually spend with their kids, I used to do home daycare and when I calculated the time I had the child versus the time the parent had the child when they weren't asleep at night, I had the child more hours during the day/week. It was really quite sad, especially in light of the fact there was no financial reason both parents needed to work.
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Re: Dear Prudence and the Jacket Response
by IncogNeato
10/12/2009, 1:44 PM #
PiquePlace:dumb_blonde, had you not heard of MOPS, or Mother's Day Out, ...
Sorry, Pique, but your patron saint "Dr." Laura says MDO is just another form of abandoning your children.
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Re: Dear Prudence and the Jacket Response
by IncogNeato
10/12/2009, 1:47 PM #
PiquePlace:I would wager the majority of children would choose mommy, even if she is sewing, mopping, or cooking.
I haven't "calmed up".
Maybe the mothers in YOUR experience engage the children in various activiities. Not all mother (or stay home fathers, grandparents, etc.) do. How engaged was DB with her kids while watching General Hospital? I'm not saying she was wrong or bad for doing so, but that her kids would have been better off for that hour in the sandbox at the daycare down the street.
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Re: Dear Prudence and the Jacket Response
by IncogNeato
10/12/2009, 1:55 PM #
PiquePlace:
All anger stems from one form of fear or another and IncogNeato had such an angry outburst at my opposing opinion (one that I tried to voice respectfully) it makes me wonder what she is so afraid of. Her argument that children are better off in what really amounts to an institutionalized environment such as daycare versus at home with a parent just doesn't hold water.
No, dear, I will use small words to help you get what I say. My words were "there is no harm". That is not the same as "children are better off." The fact is, long term, it make NO difference for most children. Perhaps your years of reading nothing above pre-school level has damaged your reading comprehension. For some, daycare is better, and for others, home is better, but no one rule holds true for all.
I don't think people who think that for THEIR family, staying home is better means they crawled out of the woodwork. Those who presume to know what is best for others' families are.
If you felt my statements composed an "angry argument", I will chalk that up to the inability to interpret voice tone and body language from the written word.
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Re: Dear Prudence and the Jacket Response
by PiquePlace
10/12/2009, 2:10 PM #
IncogNeato:If you felt my statements composed an "angry argument", I will chalk that up to the inability to interpret voice tone and body language from the written word. Bold type, claiming someone of my "ilk" climbed out of the
woodwork, sarcastically suggesting I can't understand anything above a
preschool level ... doesn't constitute an "angry argument"?. Wow! You
had an absolute hissy fit over my suggestion the letter writer
re-examine if they really need to send the child to daycare. And
you're still having a hissy fit. If you have that hard of a time handling opposing views, perhaps a discussion forum isn't right for you.
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Re: Dear Prudence and the Jacket Response
by IncogNeato
10/12/2009, 3:10 PM #
If you think telling you that you don't get to make the rules for other people's families constitutes a "hissy fit", then obviously you can't be reasoned with. I'm done.
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