The problem with Ted Haggard is not so much what he did or may have done in terms of homosexual activity but his hypocrisy in being so self-righteous about what others are doing in terms of homosexuality. Human sexuality is complex; it goes along a spectrum.

The Christian religion has clear standards as to what constitutes sexual morality. Most people Christian or not do not live up to those standards. It's not all black and white. There are sometimes complex psychological forces at play when people sin sexually. It's not all sin. This seems to be the case with Haggard.

Part of the problem is trying to force everyone into a marriage paradigm. Some people and not just homosexuals are neither suited or called to the married state. The Christian right needs to acknowledge the importance and value of the single vocation as well. Christians with a homosexual orientation are not called to marriage but neither are they called to a "gay" lifestyle. They are called to a life of chastity in the single state.

I agree that the Christian right needs to acknowledge the importance of singleness in Christianity. Paul has many positive things to say about it. However in Christianity singleness must be tied to celibacy.

So the best that gays can hope for in Christianity is to stay single and celibate?So much for the idea that all of us are made in the image of an omnipotent god.If all people are made in the image of an omnipotent god then you would have to admit that this god created gays just as he created straights and that gays can be good Christians just like straights can.

So good of you to recreate god in your image.

"God created man, male and female, he created them." - Genesis. The fact that heterosexuality is God's design for mankind is in the Scripture. I didn't write the Scripture. We are made in the image of God because our soul has an intellect and will. God is a pure Spirit; he is composed of intellect and will alone. He has no body; therefore he has no sexuality. What is your point?

God creates no person gay, anymore than he creates people who are blind, deaf, lame or dumb. All of these conditions arise from Original Sin. God permits these defects to occur, he does not cause them. There never was meant to be a Heaven on the earth. All people have crosses to bear.

Agree. Celibacy is chastity in the single state.

Because (your Scriptures claim) God created humans male and female in no way requires that marriage take place (when were Adam & Eve married?) or that it be heterosexual. OT verses alleged to prohibit homosexuality are iffy at best, seemingly more oriented toward the prohibition of male temple prostitution.

As to your God creating people gay, you are merely speculating. Nowhere does it say that Jehovah created people only in a state of heterosexuality, or that being gay was contrary to their proper state, or that marriage was forbidden to gay people.

Gay people only have a "cross to bear" because of Christian (and other religious) bigotry.

All of these conditions arise from Original Sin. God permits these defects to occur, he does not cause them.

Your reasoning is undercut by the words of Jesus himself in John 9:3. In addition, due to what Original Sin do plants and animals occur with similar conditions? Whether you believe they occur by permission or by cause, I recommend proceeding with care in this line of reasoning; you could wind up seriously impugning the Originator of Intelligent Design's competence. And that would sound like blasphemy.

Well, since only a handful of us here, regardless of religious belief, believes in Intelligent Design, that is a moot point.

I suggest that there are a handful of literal (or near-literal) Genesis Creationists and the rest are mostly Evolutionists.

As for Original Sin, what is your source for belief in that concept -- other than Catholic tradition, that is.

Thomas Paine,

It is clear from your comments that I failed to achieve what I was after in my comments: that the beliefs behind the lines I quoted from the earlier poster, when explored and followed rigorously, lead to some pretty knotty problems, if not outright contradictions. I had hoped that those who have been taught such thinking (and the poster I quoted is certainly not alone) would be encouraged to rethink it. Perhaps my mistake was attempting to do so by sticking to the terms of their belief system. The same probably holds true for my comment to the 7th item (way back on page 1) in this discussion thread. Oh, well . . . .

"Gays" can be good Christians. Celibate, just like all the other singles.