I married a man (divorced) with two grown children and one granddaughter. I've always been called Grandma ______ or Granny by her. Two other grandchildren have come along since our marriage and they have always called me Granny. I tell my husband all the time "the children may be yours, but the grandchildren are mine". I had no children of my own, thus no 'biological' grandchildren.

Nothing has been taken away from their 'biological' grandmother because of their love for me.

One thing no one has mentioned yet--perhaps Beatrice just finds it obnoxious that her step-grandchildren call her by her first name? It's not very respectful. "Grandma" or "Grandma Beatrice" or even "Grandma Smith" (or Nana or whatever)need not be more than a courtesy title, and she has a right to insist on *some* title of this sort.

Why on earth would you complicate a family relationship by "insisting" on people calling you by one name or another? How is "Grandma Beatrice" any more respectful than "Beatrice" if the only reason they're adding "Grandma" is that you stood over them and harped until they caved in? That's not respect or love; it's just...harping until you get your way.

Beatrice's decision to put her husband's grandkids in the middle of this situation demonstrates a lack of concern for their feelings -- perhaps the same thing that has harmed her relationship with their parents. The grandchildren have been taught over many years to call her "Beatrice," and there is no point in bringing it up now except to make trouble. She's pissed off that her stepchildren are unpleasant to her, and there's no way to know whose fault that is, but she's trying to solve that problem by dragging their children into it, which necessarily divides their loyalties and is highly unfair to them.

If she loved them as a grandmother should, she would never, ever put them in this position by trying to force them to do something they're uncomfortable with. Notably, nowhere in the letter does the LW say Beatrice has been good to the grandchildren or kind or warm to them. We know nothing about the relationship except that the grandkids have clearly tried to stay out of the family unpleasantness, and they're being dragged into it by Beatrice, which should not happen.

This is Beatrice's way of making a point against her stepchildren by getting their children to call her "Grandma" against their wishes, and I'm surprised that Prudie wasn't wise to the manipulation.

You make some good points about the possibility that she's dragging the kids into the family unpleasantness, but I think you missed my point about kids calling an older woman by her first name. She's probably the only older adult in the family who has no honorific. (I don't insist that my sibs' kids address me as "Aunt" Spin, but most of them do most of the time, and even if they don't I'm still "their Aunt Spin.")

So if she doesn't much like being addressed as "Beatrice" by people no longer children but far from her contemporaries, what's the alternative, if not Grandma--Mrs.??

Well, to me, the answer is that you don't always get to tell other people how they're allowed to speak, and that if she's let it go for this long, she's waived the right to object. When you deal with other adults, sometimes they speak as they choose, and your choices are to learn to deal with it or insist on having your own way at the expense of the relationship.

There's absolutely nothing in the letter indicating that this is the issue. There's no indication that she would prefer "Mrs. So-and-so," and yes, if people do not feel comfortable addressing you as Grandma and you insist they not call you by your first name, if they choose to indulge you, it will be by calling you "Mrs.," with all the warmth that implies. This, to me, would be a pyrrhic victory at best, but certainly, she can try it if this is really what's bothering her.

Actually, you do get to tell people younger than you that you'd rather they not address you by your first name.

..."That would be Mrs. Messy."

I LOATHE it when people just feel free to use my first name uninvited. This applies particularly to nurses, phlebotomists, clerks, waiters, salespeople, car dealers, etc. I know it's supposed to create a warm fuzzy friendly feeling according to the manuals, but I find it obnoxious.

It may be old-fashioned (?), but I choose who gets to address me by my first name. If someone insists on not listening to me, I either ignore them or say, "That would be Mrs. Messy to you."

I usually don't make an issue of it--but last week the cashier at the grocery store called me by my first name! Guess it came up when she scanned my card. I thought that was a bit much.

And though I'm no spring chicken, I never call people of my parents' generation by their first names unless they explicitly ask me to.

"Actually, you do get to tell people younger than you that you'd rather they not address you by your first name."

Sure. You can tell people whatever you want to, but the way life works in my experience is that sometimes, other independent-minded adults make their own decisions instead of following your instructions, and how well you adjust to that reality dictates much of your future happiness. If Beatrice really would prefer to be called "Mrs. So-and-so," she can certainly ask, and it would be polite for them to comply, but she has no right to demand that people who are not and do not consider themselves to be her grandchildren address her as "Grandma" simply on her say-so.

As for the idea that any older person gets bossing rights over any younger person in this respect, I don't sign on to any rule allegedly based on "respect" that doesn't have to be earned and doesn't work in reverse. The notion that age alone grants you to right to dictate to other adults in a way you wouldn't allow them to dictate to you is absurd, in my personal opinion, and I can't imagine why any two people would need that kind of structural inequity built into their relationship if they have any mutual respect at all.

Petty arguments over ridiculous nonsense are the hallmark of relationships that are already troubled, which is the point I meant to make in the first place. What Beatrice is called is not the issue: Beatrice is using the "call me Grandma" nonsense to tweak her stepchildren because of the underlying dynamic. If she really objected to being called "Beatrice" by her stepchildren and grandchildren, she'd have brought it up long ago.

I don't distinguish by age. I do not permit people I don't know to call me by my first name. Who they are really doesn't matter to me. If you're fine with being called random nicknames by total strangers, then knock yourself out. Be a doormat.

It DOES have to to with respect - the basic respect anyone should give to another human being. People who are overly familiar are creepy.

I've found that the best way to discourage excessive familiarity is to knock the rude little shits on their ass.

That, or ask them "Who the fuck gave you permission to address me by my first name?" and swell up menacingly...

Being a big ol' misanthrope has its advantages!

Leggy, I've been told by reliable people that I'm about as menacing as a ten-week-old kitten. I don't even have a good growl. Sigh. Apparently I can be a bit intimidating if a peer over my glasses at people, but most don't get that that's a sign of extreme annoyance.

However, if someone does gather the nerve to call me something I've told them not to, I've been known to....

1. Ask for a manager.

2. Ask for another salesperson.

3. Ask if there's a grownup working there.

4. I have left two car dealerships when I was ready to buy, just because of the way the sales minions acted (one asked if he could call The Boy and see if I had permission to make that decision), AFTER I spoke with the manager and told them why I was leaving.

5. Stop talking to that person - literally walk away from them in mid-sentence.

6. Go to a ratings website for whatever kind of business it is and let the world know what happened.

Sorry to hear that you lack the wherewithal to physically intimidate. Have you considered purchasing a Taser or pepper spray? Think of the pleasure that watching some ill-mannered little puke flopping around on the floor at your feet, squealing like turd on fire... heh.

Actually, your methods are probably just as effective, although I doubt that the sales-pukes even understood what the problem was. I have no use for that particular parasitic life-form known as "the car salesman". They're almost as bad as realtors.

If you want, you could hire me to come by and knock 'em on their ass for you, although the per-diem (Washington St. to Chi-town) might be prohibitive...

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Oh, the irony of being lectured about respect like this:

"If you're fine with being called random nicknames by total strangers, then knock yourself out. Be a doormat."

As you know, nothing I said has anything to do with being called random nicknames by total strangers. It has to do with being addressed by your first name by an adult who is a member of your family. You're inventing irrelevant things to yell at me about simply because I don't agree with you. I hardly think that puts anyone in a position to lecture me about courtesy.

Speaking of ridiculous nonsense...

So when you meet a friend's mother and you address her as "Pat," and she says, "Please call me Mrs. Brown," you say, "Well, Pat, I decide what I'm going to call people, and I choose to call you Pat." And she says--what? "Oh, OK, thanks for setting me straight"?