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Dickerson: Yesterday's Cliches Today
by riccaric

As part of his series on the "achilles heel" of the presidential candidates, John Dickerson of Slate argues that Rudy Giuliani's strategy of attacking the Democrats "risks damaging his chances in the general election by alienating moderates and independents."

Something tells me that they're not really worried about this at Giuliani headquarters.

What Dickerson is doing is recycling the age-old cliche about presidential candidates "playing to the base" in the primaries and then changing tack to appeal to "moderates and independents" in the general election.

However, the cliche desperately needs to be updated if it's going to apply to the 2008 election.

Because things have changed.

Most importantly, the partisans in both the Democratic and Republican parties have become much more ideological over the last six years. Given that Dickerson's writing about Rudy Giuliani, let's just consider the Republicans here. Republicans have become much more conservative than they were in 2008 and demand that their candidates toe the conservative line. In other words, conservatives want to hear that the Iraq War is good, torture is appropriate, global warming is a myth, the Bush administration is not conservative enough, and the Democrats are effeminate and ineffective if not treasonous.

The activist Republican base wants to try Giuliani on for size as a result of his performance during 9-11 but also have major doubts as a result of his divorces, pro-choice stance, and basic social liberalism. If Giuliani is going to maintain his 25-27% support among Republicans, he therefore needs to deepen his support among activist conservatives. And that's what Giuliani's baiting the Democrats is about. Every time Giuliani throws some red-meat to the base by bashing the Democrats, he solidifies his support with the right-wingers who already like him and makes himself more credible with other Republicans.

Otherwise, Giuliani has no chance of winning the Republican nomination.

What about appealing to moderates in the general election?

There's several reasons that's not going to happen.

First, there aren't that many people who are genuinely independent. As Matthew Dowd established while he worked in the Bush White House, most moderates and independents vote for one party most of the time and the real number of voters who have to make a decision is something like 7 or 8%.

There could be an argument for the number of independents increasing for 2008. Given the tremendous unpopularity of the Bush administration, a percentage of Republican-leaning independents might have moved over into the "undecided" category. But it's also likely that a number of formerly undecided voters have moved over to the Democratic-leaning camp. So, I'm not sure that argument pans out either.

Second, the media is heavily focused on the "consistency" and "authenticity" of presidential candidates. Of course, partisan bloggers keep a close eye on the consistency of candidates and criticize them heavily for wavering. But the mainstream media also likes consistency stories. Because such stories involve so little reflection, they're an attractive way for hard-working political reporters to punch out articles on deadline.

As a result, it's much harder for candidates to get away with changing their story line for the general election.

Not that this particularly bothers the Republicans. What the Republican Party has often done is mount smear campaigns against Democratic candidates during the general election campaigns. The Swift Boat campaign and the Willie Horton ads were vicious, hyper-partisan, and successful because they convinced enough independent voters that the Democratic candidate could not be a credible president.

It turns out that Republicans like to "appeal to the middle" by being even more viciously partisan than when they're appealing to the base.

That's one reason why Giuliani's focused on his current put-downs of the Democrats. If he wins the Republican nomination, he'll have to rev the partisanship up further.

Re: Dickerson: Yesterday's Cliches Today
by NickD

I agree the current Republican stratagy in the Primaries is to ramp up the hate. Then in the general election they will only increase the hatemongering by additional factors of ten.

Then when anyone dare say anything negative about their candidates they will howl to the winds about negativiity and their bible thumping southern hypocrits will ramp up their hate campaigns by another three or four factors. Then blahther on about their moral codes while continuing their smears and distortions.

The Democrats need only remind Americans about the GOP record for the previous 14 years.

Record debt

Massive Corruption

Record deficits

Record energy prices.

Record healthcare costs

Incompetent war stratagies

Record Trade Deficits

Increased poverty

Shrinking middle class

on and on and on and on.

The true GOP record.

The Democrats need to already be reminding America of this and the GOPs obstructionist tendencies in Congress to prevent them from doing anything.

Re: Dickerson: Yesterday's Cliches Today
by riccaric

Much as I'm sympathetic with your point of view, I have to admit that the Democrats lost with those talking points in 2004. We need something more.

Re: Dickerson: Yesterday's Cliches Today
by mdjohngolf

The Democrats solution is SURRENDER. RETEAT.

They are total inept.

Re: Dickerson: Yesterday's Cliches Today
by NickD

riccaric,

In 04 the dems lost because Kerry was truly a poor candidate who let the GOP walk all over him. he screamed bring it on in front of friendly crowds but when the GOP brought it on he did nothing.

America has finally run up against the wall and are fed up with Bushes baloney. The fact that the GOP carried his water and refused to accept the reality of Bushs ineptitude have left the GOP far more vulnerable than they were in 04. However the Dems need a strong candidate who will punch in the mouth as hard as the GOP punches. If they nominate someone with a backbone they will win. Meanwhile the Dems must remind the voters of the GOP dismal record to help defray the swiftboat BS they will certainly employ.

Re: Dickerson: Yesterday's Cliches Today
by NickD
mdjohngolf:

The Democrats solution is SURRENDER. RETEAT.

They are total inept.

The GOP startagy was to never give our forces the tools, the troops or stratagy needed to be successful. And if anyone dare raise the subject of dumbfields arrogant dismissal of reality or Bushes refusal to accept reality why simply brand them a traitor. Never mind the skeptics have been proven right nearly every single time.

Bush let Osama go free, why don't you care? he promised to capture him dead or alive, just another typical broken Bushism. Yep just more of the GOP incompetent record.

Re: Dickerson: Yesterday's Cliches Today
by bsharporflat

mdjohngolf : The Democrats solution is SURRENDER. RETEAT.

I've heard doctors have bad handwriting. I guess bad spelling as well, unless Dr. John means they sew new breasts onto mastectomy victims.

Personally I don't see why Democrats don't favor a continuous, eternal presence in Iraq. It provides a valuable "thin the herd" service by eliminating Republicans when they are young, hopefully before they breed and overpopulate.

Republican young men do all join the army while democrats go to college right? Oh don't TELL me there are Republican chicken hawks still breeding. How unfair is that?

Re: Dickerson: Yesterday's Cliches Today
by scottyhope

I think you're right about "independents" to an extent, many do lean democrat or republican, but that's only if they show up to vote. It seems like the real challenge of winning over the independents is to get them to show up in the first place.

Appealing to partisanship and demeaning the other party will rile up Rudy's base, which is good in the primary, but it won't get non-voters to the voting booth because they'll see it for what it is: partisan smearing. I guess on the plus side (for Rudy), if you can put enough blood in the water and convince democratic-leaning independents that they have no good choices then you've got a battle between party-faithful and an electoral college toss-up (again).

Re: Dickerson: Yesterday's Cliches Today
by mdjohngolf

O!! You are so right that was the GOP strategy was to never our forces the tools. That why Reid and the Democrats want to give the enemy all the help they can. Because they care so much as they sell this country down the river. All for they own political gain. .

The Democrats solution is SURRENDER. RETEAT.

Re: Dickerson: Yesterday's Cliches Today
by riccaric

One thing I like about right-wingers is your insistence on repeating certain "magic words." For this idiot, the magic words are "retreat" and "surrender." For others, the words are "Petraeus" and "victory." Too bad that's all they're capable of.

Re: Dickerson: Yesterday's Cliches Today
by mdjohngolf

O!! You are so brilliant. You are so clever. "magic words". So creative. Pray tell you what is the left "magic words" Bush lied. Just so clever! Your only answer is still "surrender".

I am so blinded by your intelligence...... not

Re: Dickerson: Yesterday's Cliches Today
by John Dickerson SlateIcon

I suppose you could call it a cliché but you should take it up with the Giuliani campaign. They’re the ones who are arguing that Giuliani is the most electable candidate in the general election because he appeals to independents. I’m not guessing at this strategy. It is their strategy as articulated to me repeatedly, as sold to high dollar donors with those pretty maps of Rudy beating Hillary Clinton in swing states and some blue states and as articulated in the links I provided. I matched that theory against his rhetoric and raised the possible tension between the two.

The piece was not a part of the Achilles’ Heel series. My piece on Rudy that was a part of that series can be found here.

Re: Dickerson: Yesterday's Cliches Today
by NickD
bsharporflat:

mdjohngolf : The Democrats solution is SURRENDER. RETEAT.

I've heard doctors have bad handwriting. I guess bad spelling as well, unless Dr. John means they sew new breasts onto mastectomy victims.

Personally I don't see why Democrats don't favor a continuous, eternal presence in Iraq. It provides a valuable "thin the herd" service by eliminating Republicans when they are young, hopefully before they breed and overpopulate.

Republican young men do all join the army while democrats go to college right? Oh don't TELL me there are Republican chicken hawks still breeding. How unfair is that?

Many of our young servicemen hail from Democratic families. Most are conditioned as a captive audience by superiors who have a vested interest in how their subordinates think. I personally know one extremely die hard Democrat who came back from his Air Force training as a hardcore born again Christian who thinks only right wing republicans should be allowed to live in America period. Yet he thinks its the world that cjanged and he is the same person.

Also where are all the young republicans now, for years the armed forces cannot meet its recruitment goals. Guess the republicans have all become traitors or cowards. Where are all the young republican business majors who went off to college? Hint enjoying their tax breaks in air conditioned McMansions.

Your little rant is senseless.

Re: Dickerson: Yesterday's Cliches Today
by bsharporflat

Um...Nick, if I had been calm, sensible and logical it wouldn't be a rant, would it? ;- )

Anyway, wasn't that what John Kerry's foot-in-mouth statement really saying? That, in the mold of the current chicken hawk administration, it is only poor, uneducated young men who are joining the army not the rich conservative families who want to send soldiers to Iraq and keep them there. Bush and Cheney as young men in a foxhole getting shot at? Nah, didn't happen. The only person Dick Cheney ever shot is...well...never mind.

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