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tired...
by wrausch

...of "extremist" pro-lifers giving the pro-life agenda a bad name, and abortion rights advocates painting(or at least suggesting) all pro-life advocates as extremists. While I am not pro-life, my mother who is both a strong willed woman and physician is, and she is hardly "extremist." She supports reducing pregnancies and providing support for the mother and her new child. She does not vote solely on the issue(in fact, being a democrat, she usually votes for a pro-choice candidate) but does feel very strongly about the issue. As a physician, she feels that the fetus is a human being, and thus protected under the law.

While abortion would be the most practical option for many women, if one believes that a child is murdered, he/she is not going to sacrifice pragmatism for what they believe is right. And yes, if you feel that what is right is giving the choice to the pregnant woman, then you would feel giving her the option is what is right. But to paint everyone on either side as "extremist" or "baby-killers" is just plain wrong and overly simplistic. It is an important issue with serious ramifications, but refusing to recognize the other sides argument as at least valid is counter productive and hateful.

Re: tired...
by Independence

Well, goodness I apparently didn't make the point to you. At least, I believe by the use of the word extremist that your post refers to mine. At least it's an opening to talk to someone who might not be waving their gold casts of aborted baby feet or a coat-hanger picture in our face.

Exactly what I tried to convey is that most Americans are not extremists in my opinion. Weisberg's article, while it takes swipes at extremism in the pro-life camp, neglects to mention any problems within his supply of information. For instance, all we hear of NOW and Planned Parenthood is some far fetched agenda that is outside the realm of what I've ever heard an actual woman say.

Perhaps there was a time to rouse the feminine conscience in such an extreme way and to shock men into seeing the plight of women at the time. Now we face a time to fine tune what we say and see ourselves as equal people not only with an agenda, but responsibility for what we do and say. (Uh, oh I can't believe I just wrote that) We have to look at the riduclosity of young women being able to have a major life altering medical procedure without their parents knowledge when they can't even go watch Schindler's List without their guardian knowing it. Who wanted this? It only breeds denial of reality and irresponsibility to us as women. Our daughters cannot face this choice alone. Can you really choose abortion alone when you are not yet able to drive, drink a beer or own a vehicle. You can't even have cosmetic surgery, but you are legally protected for an invasive procedure all on your own when you're a teenager without your family even being told and often the majority of counseling you might get is from your teenage friends on MYspace. Is that helping young women. My last issue with the handling of the abortion issue is if you can actually say that it is solely your body when the other entity harbored may have a different blood type than the female. These are my ponderings on the issue and I somewhat wonder if it isn't average americans thoughts as well. You know isn't that something to discuss besides coathangers and burned baby bodies?

No one wants a woman to die because of a pregnancy. No one wants a young womans life to be trashed. There are instances of necessity I suppose. We just have so much to discuss and let the talking heads and talking typers feed us our faction-biased popcorn while we watch.

Regarding the Weisberg piece it is very informed but it still is only half informed. That was my point, perhaps I'll never get paid to write for Slate due to an inability to effectively communicate my point;)

Regarding the term baby-killers...you know I just dislike that term altogether because there are men who were tortured by that term in the not so distant past, perhaps even reading this forum and while I may be slightly bent now I used to occasionally connect them to helplines and suicide hotlines in the midst of the night so I just pass that on (no extra charge)

Re: tired...
by buggie

wrausch:

...of "extremist" pro-lifers giving the pro-life agenda a bad name, and abortion rights advocates painting(or at least suggesting) all pro-life advocates as extremists. While I am not pro-life, my mother who is both a strong willed woman and physician is, and she is hardly "extremist." She supports reducing pregnancies and providing support for the mother and her new child. She does not vote solely on the issue(in fact, being a democrat, she usually votes for a pro-choice candidate) but does feel very strongly about the issue. As a physician, she feels that the fetus is a human being, and thus protected under the law.

While abortion would be the most practical option for many women, if one believes that a child is murdered, he/she is not going to sacrifice pragmatism for what they believe is right. And yes, if you feel that what is right is giving the choice to the pregnant woman, then you would feel giving her the option is what is right. But to paint everyone on either side as "extremist" or "baby-killers" is just plain wrong and overly simplistic. It is an important issue with serious ramifications, but refusing to recognize the other sides argument as at least valid is counter productive and hateful.

wrausch:

...of "extremist" pro-lifers giving the pro-life agenda a bad name, and abortion rights advocates painting(or at least suggesting) all pro-life advocates as extremists. While I am not pro-life, my mother who is both a strong willed woman and physician is, and she is hardly "extremist." She supports reducing pregnancies and providing support for the mother and her new child. She does not vote solely on the issue(in fact, being a democrat, she usually votes for a pro-choice candidate) but does feel very strongly about the issue. As a physician, she feels that the fetus is a human being, and thus protected under the law.

While abortion would be the most practical option for many women, if one believes that a child is murdered, he/she is not going to sacrifice pragmatism for what they believe is right. And yes, if you feel that what is right is giving the choice to the pregnant woman, then you would feel giving her the option is what is right. But to paint everyone on either side as "extremist" or "baby-killers" is just plain wrong and overly simplistic. It is an important issue with serious ramifications, but refusing to recognize the other sides argument as at least valid is counter productive and hateful.

I just want to point out some of the important words in your post: "she FEELS the fetus is a human being" "what they BELIEVE is right." This is the entire crux of all it. It's all about beliefs and feelings. How can the government be involved in something that is ALL about beliefs and feelings? How can they deny people the right to have their own beliefs and feelings? Why are we even debating things like this in the context of presidential election?


Re: tired...
by zimmerk
Medical science proves that the fetus is a human being. It is a scientific fact, thanks to advances in technology that allow ever more precise research including that of the genetics field.
Re: tired...
by buggie

zimmerk:
Medical science proves that the fetus is a human being. It is a scientific fact, thanks to advances in technology that allow ever more precise research including that of the genetics field.

Um, citations please???

What defines a "human being" anyway? And at what point does a fetus become one? There hasn't been any "scientific proof" regarding this, if there were I think we might have heard of it.

Re: tired...
by Philadelphia Steve

Conservatives declare it happens at the moment of conception. However they have not declared if that oment is:

When a spem contacts the surface of an ovum

When a spem penetrates the surface of an ovum

When the ovum seals its outer layer so that other spem cannot penetrate

When the united spem and ovum implant on the uterus wall (or falopian tube, which is disasterous,b ut Conservatives do not like to talk about that).

There are multiple moments, but I have outlined some of the scientific "moments", and those are much too detailed for Conservatives to ponder. They would rather decree and control.

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