"Perhaps a touch of formality will help us remember that, whatever their many good qualities, both are self-centered, driven, ambitious, calculating, manipulative politicians—because they have to be."

Interesting how such behavior was a sin for Hillary Clinton but OK for the two presumptive MALE nominees....

Yeah, THAT is interesting, NJ Gal. Thanks for pointing it out.

behavior? Self centered, driven, ambitious calculating, manipulative...

Or should we follow the 11th commandment only?

Very true, NJ Gal. To me that's the problem with any serious woman candidate--she's either going to be "too nice" to be president, or too much of a ruthless bitch to be likeable. I'm not sure if there is a balance that would satisfy those who are looking for an excuse not to vote for a woman.

Maybe the problem with Hillary is that she is both not likable and a ruthless person. I don't recall anyone ever being quoted that, as a person, she is nice. Only certain people are born with the charisma to be leaders. Leadership isn't something that can be cultivated or read out of a book. Bill had it. Unfortunately for Hillary, Obama has it. She doesn't. With Bill and Obama, we know they may be lying, but we accept it. With Hillary, we know up front that she is trying to manipulate us and is lying most of the time. And... we resent it because of her total lack of charisma (or personality if you prefer).

I've heard people call Hillary nice. In fact, most people who know her say that.

Perhaps the 'real double standard' Lithy Mike is that you accept "politician behavior" from men, but not from women? who, you perhaps regard as more virtuous because of dear old mom? (that's putting a grand spin on your predjudices innit?).

Very true, and very perceptive of you. Double standards everywhere. Obviously Hillary did not get the nomination purely because she was female, and we do not expect her to act a certain way. Obviously Obama is popular purely because he is black and is getting a free pass with the media. Obviously McCain is part of the "good old boys" club which is why he is the nominee. Of course there is NO other reason for anyone to get anywhere in politics.

AMEN!! Say it again, Sister. All the months we listened to analyists report on "polls" that said that people thought that Hillary was calculative , untrustworthy, manipulative, ruthless- thus unfit for the job of uniting the U.S., I sat aghasted. Becauce when I looked at Obama, he had all of those traits ten times over.

Thanks for saving me a post, NJ Gal

I disagree entirely with you, LithMike. I think that leadership qualities actually can be learned. I also wonder how on earth you knows that Hillary is not likeable. Have you met her? Was she mean to you? What you really mean to say is that Hillary is perceived as unlikeable. This is because she is a woman, and she doesn't fit the public ideal of womanliness, which is unfairly inconsistent with also being a politician.