Are Hillary supporters really as vapid and self-centered as they appear to be through the media conduit? This is not an accusation, but an honest question. I personally don't know any other than my mother and even she has come around on Obama with absolutely no residual hard feelings. She is a lifelong party supporter and is willing to put aside any personal misgivings for the good of the country and the world. Should this not be the case for all of us who have voiced opposition to the current administration's woeful policies? Sebelius is a strong, very qualified VP candidate who has shown the ability to stand firm on principles as well as bridge the ever growing chasm of American divisive politics. She is likable, well spoken and has a virtually stainless track record (thus far), especially regarding the perennially topical issues of education and health care. What's not to like? Aren't people through with legacy politics, or does the current trend of xenophobia dominate, even if it leads us to act against our best interests? Isn't it time for a changing of the guard? Please excuse the bevy of rhetorical questions, but I am honestly ashamed and baffled.

you guys slay me

hillary and her supporters were, for the most part, treated VERY poorly by obama and his supporters

yet , we are supposed to just jump in line with obama?

MANY of us think the DNC unfairly PICKED obama and USED THE RULES to get him elected...i mean the DAY AFTER obama won he said DEAN WILL STAY!!! can you say quid pro quo?

even after he may choose ANOTHER woman for v.p. another GREEN as grass candidate....

i NEVER in my life have seen such an UNQUALIFIED democrat make it to run for president

i dont even know if i could EVER vote for somebody i think is wholly unqualified for the job

hell he cant DO THE JOB HE HAS NOW...hasnt had a hearing on afghanistan yet has he? i dont know WHAT people think when they think he is up for the job

i have seen NO EVIDENCE of that

in fact i think obama has shown VERY poor judgement in alot of cases.....his so called "church" being the biggest blunder of all

im sure obama is a good man....carter, the OTHER hope and change candidate , was a good man also.....but INEFFECTIVE as president.

aldine1494:

Are Hillary supporters really as vapid and self-centered as they appear to be through the media conduit? This is not an accusation, but an honest question.

If you read many post from the very bitter Hillary supporters you can only come to the conclusion that they are vapid and self-centered. They indict themselves. Over and over they warn the Democratic party that they will vote for McCain if Clinton isn't on the ticket. They are willing to have more conservatives appointed to the Supreme Court by a McCain presidency which is literally biting off their noses to spite their faces. McCain's appointments to the high court would be the worse thing in history for causes most important to Democrats, especially female Democrats.

Oh, calm down. In a few weeks any supporter of Clinton's who is truly a Democratic party supporter will come around. Let people let off steam for a while, why don'tcha?

In what way did the DNC pick Obama (fairly or unfairly)? By the agreed-upon rules, Obama won the pledged delegate totals. You can talk about Florida and Michigan, but the candidates agreed to not campaign there, so in what sense can it be said to have been a fair election? It is unfortunate that the voters in those states were disenfranchised, but (1) the parties have a need to maintain an orderly primary schedule, (2) once again, an election without a campaign is hardly fair, and (3) if Hillary wanted to stand up for the rights of those voters she should have done so at the time, not later when they proved useful to her.

Now, because neither candidate won enough pledged delegates to secure the nomination, the superdelegates mattered, but there is no reason to say that the superdelegates, in affirming the pledged delegates, did anything unseemly (unlike had they reversed it).

On the subject of qualifications, here's a challenge for you: list the recent presidents in terms of qualifications and see if there is any correlation between experience and performance. I'm betting you'll decide there isn't... but it does provide a convenient rationalization...

The better question may be "Are Obama supporters really as stupid as the media, press and blogs suggest?"

Far beyond sexism, The media had picked Obama and marketed , yes I'll say it again, "marketed him as the elected candidate for their own selfish reasons (see New Capitalism)

At the same time they under represented and mischaracterized the people and issues for the supporters of HRC. We are not bitter, emotional or undereducated, menopausal the list goes on. What did this treatment of the Obama campaign and Obama himself tell us:

1, image is more important than substance.

2, The media and the wealthy supporters behind Obama believe his demographic constituencies have more money, spend money on the products and services they represent and have more time to spend.

3. The issues don't matter-HRC championed the poor the immigrant and women. Issues that do not reflect the marketing interests of Corporations and supporters of Obama.

4. Many people will believe anything they read or see on TV, especially the young who do not have enough life experience yet to understand that all politicians are just that, politicians. Experience does matter because with experience comes a different and more powerful perspective to implement change.

5. The media does not want the Clintons in the White House again. In truth, this bias represents a schism in the belief that all the candidates (or anyone is equal or anyone can run for president)

6. There really is no possiblity for change as corprate interests and money are behind politics: Yes its true!! and the complexities of foreign policy in the middle east and terrorism post 911; the uncontrollable price of feul;world demand for oil; increasing grain and commodity prices for the wealthy to consider the growth prospects of the failing economy( reached its limit and as with all powerful nations is in decline) and therefore look to global markets for their gain. This will be at the expense of the day to day needs of the average person in America. W/O Hillary clinton there will be no significant change in Healthcare. Just you watch!

7. Obama is the smiling, nice guy that delivers eloquent speeches that other people write for him. He is just a puppet that will be used by the wealthy supporters, endorcers and politicians that want to stay wealthy. The wealthy want to stay wealthy-they will never allow a candidate to be elected that will threaten their wealth and power and the values that the wealthy epouse. "elitism"

8. Sex does matter in America no matter how much the pundits and politicians deny it. Just for fun check out The media hall of Shame just for laughs

<link>

9. Obama and his supporters and the DNC have short memories. You think we will "see the light" and join the Obama ship because you have done nothing but complement us, demonstrate interest in our perspectives and interests-support our frustration with the poor treatment of Hillary Clinton and the way that the media virtually ignored 18,000,000 of us-if they and Obama supporters weren't insulting us.

10. As this thread suggests in its title there is no grace or honor in Obama winning-just continuous vitriol and ignorance of important issues relevent to millions of Americans across the nation. If he and the people behind him choose Kathleen Selibus-that doesnot change the above issues which are plain to most of us...ie She's a woman that should pacify the self centred , ignorant, undereducated, emotional, bitter Hillary supporters. Yeah right!

Finally, there is this belief among many Obama supporters that it should be party before country. I'm sorry, each person must vote according to their conscience and whats right for the good of the country, beleive it or not...I know this is difficul-t but I just can't buy Obama . I see the man (men) behind the curtain and yes, we are paying attention.

most of these BO supporters are newbies to the politcal scene and dont know how politically INEPT they really are

throwing away votes is NOT a way to win

and your right....the BO supporters have done NOTHING to endear themselves to us and for that matter neither has obama

hell the man didnt even get over 50 % of the votes

he and hillary BOTH got 47%

there is NO democratic mandate....but the BO supporters sure do ACT like it

there is that ineptness again

The point is not whether to put party above country.
Of course you shouldn't do that. The point is that, if you have Democratic Party positions on the issues (like Hillary Clinton does), your policy positions are a lot closer to Obama's than McCain.

Now, you may say that McCain is more qualified to be president that Obama. Presumably that means you feel he would be a more capable president, but that doesn't really change anything.

Why is McCain being better at implementing an agenda I DON'T believe in better than Obama would be at implementing an agenda I DO believe in a good thing for McCain? If I was chosing between a bus to heaven and a bus to hell, I wouldn't get on the hell bus because it goes faster...

1) the cannard that hillary was somehow breaking the rules by leaving her name on the michigan ballot is a LIE....one perpetuated by obama , his supporters and the dnc.dodd and kucinich were on the ballot as well

2)obama ALMOST got his 50/50 split on the florida and michigan like he wanted....but at the rules "lunch break" all hell broke loose and THEN they decided to apportion delegates proportionally. TAKING four of hillary's delegates AWAY from her and giving them to obama who got his delegates by EXIT POLLS.....honestly ....is this the LEAST little bit fair?

btw if obama had GOTTEN 50/50 like he wanted he would have TAKEN 9 of hillary's delegates

3) if the democratic party is going to get in the business of NOT counting votes i have come to a crossroads where i will probably LEAVE the dem party.....the DNC USED the rules to enable obama....pure and simple.....our affirmative action candidate

then the DAY AFTER obama won the nomination he TOLD everyone that DEAN would STAY at the dnc.....can you say quid pro quo?????????????

the 'DISIPLINE" the dnc doled out was so that NEW HAMPSHIRE AND IOWA remain FIRST in the primary process....WHY? those states DO NOT represent the demographics of the REST of the united states.....why in the world do they have to be first ???????? to the exclusion of NOT COUNTING VOTES???????? i would really like someone to take a stab at an answer on THAT one.

there are MANY reasons the hillary supporters are NOT falling in line

myself i CANNOT vote for someone i dont think is QUALIFIED for the job

im old enough to remember the OTHER hope and change candidate....his name? jimmy carter.....the most INEFFECTIVE democratic president in modern history....ive seen this ALL before

well your analogy is interesting

obama isnt heaven

and mccain isnt hell

but amusing nevertheless

I may not vote for anyone-independent.

At least with Bill Clinton the economy was the strongest in American History. Hillary has little to earn or prove as president at this stage of her life-she's been top of the pile (if you know what I mean)And, since 2001 there has been plenty of time to consider what could have been done better? what should I not do (learning from experience) and finally leave a legacy of a better life for the American people. Obama, young, still learning the ropes and owing the debt to those wealthy mogula behind him-He will be used he is food for the sharks.

Oh yeah? Did you read the whole post? Why do Obama supporter have such a definate filter to the obvious?

A little piece of advice. Respond to what the other person said, don't just dip into your grab bag of talking points for whatever seems vaguely relevant.

I never said anything about Obama or Hillary being on the ballot in Michigan. What I said is that there was no campaign in either state (Michigan or Florida). The candidates agreed not to campaign there. How an election without a campaign can be considered fair eludes me.

I'm not a fan of Iowa and New Hampshire being first, but someone does have to be first and letting every state jump to the head of the line would be a disaster. I'd rather the process be more centrally controlled and the spots rotate through different states. The point is that it is unfortunate what happened to those voters, but the DNC (and RNC) had good reasons for doing what they did, and the election was hardly entirely valid.

What, exactly, is the difference between "the DNC USED the rules to enable obama" and "the DNC followed the rules and Obama won"? I mean, of course, other than proper capitalization...

If you think a McCain administration would be better for the country, then vote accordingly in November. I think you're wrong, but I'm not going to tell you how to live your life (except to say that you should learn how to organize and express your thoughts (and I use the term loosely) better).

im sorry to say this

but BO supporters seem ALOT like bush bots

who ALWAYS make excuses for bush and NEVER hold him accountable

AND alot of them TALK about hillary JUST LIKE THE CONS DO

but they dont see it

obama has them believing he himself and his supporters are BETTER than the rest of us.

what a joke

HALF of the dem party doesnt think so

POINTS HAVE HIT THE MARK

you know what REALLY gets me

when idiots like FOOB think they can tell me WHAT to type, HOW to type it and im supposed to AGREE with them or else be made to feel like im not communicating

i think you got what i had to say JUST FINE mr i think im so much better than you.

or else you would not have had such a good melt for everyone to see

now YOU get over yourself

you are NOT better, or smarter or anything else you think that makes YOU superior

egomaniac

screw you? did you UNDERSTAND THAT? IDIOT?

dems rock:

POINTS HAVE HIT THE MARK

you know what REALLY gets me

when idiots like FOOB think they can tell me WHAT to type, HOW to type it and im supposed to AGREE with them or else be made to feel like im not communicating

i think you got what i had to say JUST FINE mr i think im so much better than you.

or else you would not have had such a good melt for everyone to see

now YOU get over yourself

you are NOT better, or smarter or anything else you think that makes YOU superior

egomaniac

screw you? did you UNDERSTAND THAT? IDIOT?

You need to control your hysteria, dear. BTW, I'm not a new voter. I'm and old man. Perhaps you need to learn to hold your nose in November if your candidate didn't get the Democratic nomination, just as I have in every election since Kennedy.