If America ignores our own values about justice then the terrorists win.

Allowing a terrorist the right to a fair trial and a lawyer and the right of appeal doesnt mean they win or succeed-it means WE win.

And if you believe that torture and denial of rights we give POWs is OK because of the crime, then you forget the difference between civilized people and terrorists. Terrorists violate the laws of justice and of civil behavoir.

Sure, it may take longer to put them in jail for life or send them to their execution as the case may be, but it shows the world we are not stooping to their level.

Bill Clintons SJC didnt need to deny the first WTC bombers any rights and they are jail for life-in fact they are pissed we wouldnt kill them so they could be martyrs.

Dont worry people-terrorists WILL get justice. Giving them rights wont keep that from happening.

The first WTC bombers were held here in New York City. During their stay here, a coupole of them attacked some prison guards, and one guard was stabbed through the eye and into his brain. He is basically a vegtable today, and those fifthly muslims pieces of shit are being taken care of by US taxpayers.

If they want to die for their ignorant mutt religion, let's kill them. There are no virgins for them, but if that's what these muslims scumbag, dog-fuckers believe...go get 'em.

Dont be so stupid Bull.

Letting them rot in jail makes a lot more sense-no glory of dying for Allah, no hero treatment for them. Its a lot cheaper to do that than spend a fortune trying to deal with thousands more who follow their "hero".

You obviously dont understand what is going on here. These people WANT to die attacking America as an inspiration to others. Letting them rot in a jail cell and showing them on TV as the patheric excuse for human beings they are is hardly a heroic image.

No one points to a prisnor for inspiration to attack.

Except for John McCain-POW. Party of old white men.

Wouldn't you considered rotting in a confine space to be inhumane? Where is your humanity? And why do you hate old white men? Isn't that age discrimination? Wish you people would make up your mind.

"Wouldn't you considered rotting in a confine space to be inhumane? Where is your humanity? And why do you hate old white men? Isn't that age discrimination? Wish you people would make up your mind."

Where did I say I hated old white men? My point on that is that McCain is an old white man like dozens of the same before him. Why not a young black man for a change?

And where did I support locking people up in a confined space? I didnt. You extrapolate your own poins from thin air-but Im used to that from Republicans. Since you got nothing you make up isms and hate because we dont hand it to you on a silver platter.

Even criticism of our government you equate to hate-yet we see it as tough love. I LOVE the USA, but that doesnt mean consider slavery or the treatment of our native Americans as OK. When Obama or others criticize the bad things the US has done it isn hate for America-it is tough love. Too bad you cant tell the difference.

As to McCain, he was at the bottom of his class and has never had a real job-in other words he is more of the same-another rich snotty military kid with no brains. No thanks.

Sorry RML, " Party of old white men " is a derogatory statement. It would be no different then saying the DNC stands for Dammed Niger Conspiracy. Both are derogatory and should be treated as such. Why make such a statement ( you also dishonored pows by doing so ) if you didn't have an agenda against old white men?

As for a young black man for a change. Well the same could be said about Condoleezza Rice. Why not a good black woman? I would vote fore her easily.

You also stated " Letting them rote in jail makes more sense ". When has jail not been a confined space? Why is it you write this shit and think we will believe you that you didn't write it.

It has nothen to do with tough love, It has to do with your statments.

Jail is where prisnors go. A jail cell is not torture unless you arent being fed or allowedd exercise.

McCain was tortured, but again how is that heroic? I do feel sorry for him because I believe he was tortured and because I believe he fought for nothing in Vietnam-we shouldnt have been there either and that was a waste of many lives, a lot of money, and McCains youth and value as a pilot.

And I didnt insult POWs. I think McCain is using that status for his political intentions-like some do with their veteran status. Doesnt make it OK.

Party of Old White Men is based on what the republicans have been offerring the people. Condaleeza was a Bush stooge and she wouldnt testify about her role in Iraq or the stonewalling of the 9/11 commission-she wouldnt get the vote of anyone with a brain nomatter what her sex or color.

Ok RML, let's put you in a 6'-0" by 8'-0" cell 20-22 hours a day, for the rest of your life. Then tell me that wouldn't be torture.

Although I am not a fan of McCain, I think anyone who could of come back to the States sooner but stayed with his peers to be tortured with them is a hero. I'd bet your ass would of been home on the first plane out. What have you done lately that could be considered as heroic?

And what is with you people? You cut down Bush for not having enough military background, you tried to make Turn-Boat Kerry look like a national hero ( like he or you didn't try to use that status for his political intentions? ) and then call POW's the Party of old White Men.

Now let's look at your claim that the Republicans are the "Party of old White Men". I suppose you think that Ted Kennedy and Robert Byrd are the sweet bird of youth? Any fool can google the Senate and see that the Democrtatic side of the U.S.Senate are mostly Old White Men.

But what makes me laugh even more, is you think that I or anyone else should vote for a man who has been a member ( for the last 20 years ) of a church that has spewed hatered towards white people. And you think you have brains?

Ok RML, let's put you in a 6'-0" by 8'-0" cell 20-22 hours a day, for the rest of your life. Then tell me that wouldn't be torture.

###### Well thats what we do to criminals here and its what we do to the uncharged and unvisited prisnors at Gitmo-not even charged-just jailed like McCain. You dont call it torture when we do it right?

"Although I am not a fan of McCain, I think anyone who could of come back to the States sooner but stayed with his peers to be tortured with them is a hero."

##### Its not my fault you call anyone in a uniform a hero (Hitler had a nice uniform too). But to my point, I believe that just being in jail while everyone else was fighting an unneccessary war hardly equates to an act of heroism.Had McCains daddy not been a rich bastard he would never have had the choice he had to be a hero or not-a fact you people always seem to ignore. McCain was not tortured to the extent most others were and it was because of his value as a rich guys kid. That said, I dont consider McCain a traitor or anything like that-I just think that you're reaching when you call him a hero. I value and respect his service to his nation-but then I value the service of Kerry and every other soldier with the balls to stand up to Nixon and the other liars and call that war what it was-a waste of life and money-just like Iraq.

" I'd bet your ass would of been home on the first plane out. What have you done lately that could be considered as heroic?"

#### Well, I dont claim to be a hero do I? If a hero is special and heroic, it stands to reason there wouldnt be too many of them. But calling everyone who signs up to be slaughtered in the meatgrinder for no reason a hero is a hell of a marketing method to keep the young and stupid going to Iraq isnt it? Am I not heroic for standing up to the lie and calling this war what it is long before most did? I asked for the data-not just power point slides-my party certainly tried (and failed) to get the raw data Bush claimed to have showing nuclear and chemical warfare abilities in Iraq and a connection to 9/11-All proven false AFTER we went to war. Kennedy showed us photos of the Russian missiles in Cuba and he avoided a war-Bush showed us nice graphics and we went into a full scale invasion and occuppation. Hero? Thats one way to lure a poor kid to his death-come and be a hero? You cheapen that word every time you use it.

"And what is with you people? You cut down Bush for not having enough military background, you tried to make Turn-Boat Kerry look like a national hero ( like he or you didn't try to use that status for his political intentions? ) and then call POW's the Party of old White Men."

###### Kerry served with honor in Vietnam under fire. Bush served in the national guard and never saw a single viet kong on the mexican border in TX. He was in fact known best for his drunken escapades according to his own fellow fliers and he refused to take his last physical because it would have shown a positive cocaine test-he went AWOL because he couldnt get his flying privledges back without taking the physical. Of course both men mentioned their service, but only Kerry was actually in combat-a point not lost on anyone comparing the records of the two. More importantly, Kerry actually went to Vietnam and served there before he ever protested the war-making him someone who saw the claims of the US government vs the reality on the ground and who made the truly heroic choice to stand up against the government when it mattered most-THAT took balls Bush would never have.

"Now let's look at your claim that the Republicans are the "Party of old White Men". I suppose you think that Ted Kennedy and Robert Byrd are the sweet bird of youth? Any fool can google the Senate and see that the Democrtatic side of the U.S.Senate are mostly Old White Men."

##### I think you take the joke a little too seriously. It is true that while the democrats range from people of all colors and sexes and sexual orientations and ages (yes including old white men), the republicans are little else but old white men and their stepford wives. I didnt see Cheneys lesbo daughter stepping up for the anti-gay agenda of her daddys party or Bush's daughter volunteering to join up when they turned 18. You must admit the RNC hasnt offerred anything new-just more of the same Bush policies. They promise to be anti anyone who doesnt fit their concept of the perfect America including anyone who isnt a Christian, anyone who isnt a heterosexual, anyone who isnt supporting the wealth structure in place already, and anyone who believes our money is wasted on pointless wars and a bloated defense budget.

"But what makes me laugh even more, is you think that I or anyone else should vote for a man who has been a member ( for the last 20 years ) of a church that has spewed hatered towards white people. And you think you have brains"

#### You are the moron. You believe a church with several white members is anti white? You believe that a black man raised in the racist south might not be a little legitimately bitter about it? Obama's minister isnt Obama anymore than your crazy uncle is you. Sure, many blacks are of the belief that the deck was stacked against them and that isnt always untrue-many white people wont vote for Obama because he is black-including your pal Chang who is clearly a racist. Obama went to a CHRISTIAN church for more than 20 years and one would think any church with such a long lifespan might do a little more than spew anti white hatred-and hey, I think being anti KKK is alright-dont you Grand Dragon?

PS-I am a WHITE guy who works for a living. The kind of person the republcans take for granted and f-ck every chance they get.

Well thats what we do to criminals here and its what we do to the uncharged and unvisited prisnors at Gitmo - not even charged - just like McCain. You don't call it torture when we do it right?

### Wrong I believe both are torture. What an idiot. It's just are both necessary?

( Hitler had a nice uniform too )

### So now you are comparing a POW ( McCain ) to Hitler. Just the fact that McCains father was a rich bastard ( as you descibed ), makes him more of a hero for not leaving.

Now let's talk about Kerry. He said he served two tours in Vietnam. This was true. However his first tour was on a ship that was station 100 or more miles from the Vietnamese shore. Must of saw a lot of action out there.

He also claimed he had 4 Purple Hearts. Once again this it true. The catch is, his own comander wouldn't award the Purple Harts to him as Kerrys wounds were either superficial or self-contributing. Maybe luck, Kerry found out that by being a comander of his own boat that he could award them to himself and that is what he did.

I'm glade you brought up Iraq. Like Vietnam, Kerry was all for going into Iraq. But in true Kerry fashion he later accused our soldiers ( as when he came back from Vietnam ) as being the real enemy and baby killers.

Yea sounds like the kind of hero you would stand behind.

As for Iraq. If we were to leave, are we going back?

Now let's address the subject of just Christians are Republicans. You'er wrong again, I have many friends that are Athiest like me that belong to the Republican party. Although I belong to no party, many of my Christian friends would wecome me to their party. Now do you have a thing agianst Christians too? Also if you look at both the House and Senate, both parties have about the same number of color, sex and age serving. Sexual orientations I will concede the Dems win hands down.You made the statement " the RNC hasn't offerred anything new ". Can you show me were the DNC has?

You also claim that Obamas church had several white members. So what. I know many people who feel by hating thier own kind will bring peace and harmony. Sorry it won't.

Had McCain belong to a church 20 or so years that preached that blacks should be slaves agian even if there were some black that also attened this church, I am very certain that you would say that McCain was a bigot. But unlike you, I would agree.

And like you- I too am a WHITE guy who works for a living. Unlike you, thanks to my Democrat Governor who gave the largest taxe hike in the history of my State to small business ( the kind of person the Democrats take for granted ) I'm going out of business.

BTW, not only am I F-cked, but so are the people who once worked for me.

Re: The simple truth you need to know
by rajhc
06/22/2008, 10:53 AM # Favorites Reply

Well thats what we do to criminals here and its what we do to the uncharged and unvisited prisnors at Gitmo - not even charged - just like McCain. You don't call it torture when we do it right?

### Wrong I believe both are torture. What an idiot. It's just are both necessary?

@@@@@ I dont approve of either, but when a country like the USA claims to have the high ground on human rights and then does the same stuff our enemies do, I take issue with our government. So if you agree its bad to do then dont do it yourself. Seems to me when its done at Gitmo the cons are OK with it-just like the death penalty-its fine if its the other guy on trial but not an American on trial elsewhere.

( Hitler had a nice uniform too )

### So now you are comparing a POW ( McCain ) to Hitler. Just the fact that McCains father was a rich bastard ( as you descibed ), makes him more of a hero for not leaving.

@@@@@ I would never compare McCain to Hiltler-Hitler was smarter than McCain. But I will say that the idea that a uniform makes someone ummune from criticism or that it gives them some hero status is a joke. Just as you point out Kerry was in a ship offshore in Vietnam few troops ever go into a dangerous situation in the so called war on terror-most are in support roles-but all are "heroes" according to the new propaganda Faux Snooze nation under der Furher Bush.

Now let's talk about Kerry. He said he served two tours in Vietnam. This was true. However his first tour was on a ship that was station 100 or more miles from the Vietnamese shore. Must of saw a lot of action out there.

@@@@@@ Honestly I dont know what Kerry did during that tour-it may have been a support role or it may well be that he was doing intel work with radio, etc. Does it matter since wearing a uniform means you're a hero?

"He also claimed he had 4 Purple Hearts. Once again this it true. The catch is, his own comander wouldn't award the Purple Harts to him as Kerrys wounds were either superficial or self-contributing. Maybe luck, Kerry found out that by being a comander of his own boat that he could award them to himself and that is what he did.

@@@@@ Back to lying again-you sure do hate Kerry as you just lied your ass off. Kerry was never accused of self inficted wounds-not only would he not get the purple heart but he would have been in big trouble. Also, you cant put yourself in for a medal. Kerry earned a silver star and his purple hearts-he got the silver star for rescuing several commandos under fire-what a pussy move huh? Cheney and the gang avoided Vietnam all together and Bush flew antiquated aircraft over the Mexican border (making sure his drugs got in safely and covering your landscapers I imagine).

"I'm glade you brought up Iraq. Like Vietnam, Kerry was all for going into Iraq."

@@@@ Most everyone was for going into Iraq since Cheney had the intel reports only show the data that supported going to war and he made sure the data which didnt support the war never got made it into the intel reports-this is why so many dems and even many republicans are angry at the Bush administration-they were duped into a pro war vote-Bush lied (with a lot of help). Even when congress insisted Bush and the rest of the liars testify they refused until promised they could do without being under oath (license to lie) and of course at the time the republican majority congress said OK to that (too bad it wasnt this congress).

" But in true Kerry fashion he later accused our soldiers ( as when he came back from Vietnam ) as being the real enemy and baby killers."

@@@@@ ANOTHER LIE!!!!!!!! Not ONCE did Kerry EVER call our troops baby killers or the enemy-not even during Vietnam and certainly not our troops in Iraq. During the first inquiries into the actions of US troops in Vietnam, Kerry admitted to witnessing actions which would never be allowed today including setting fire to homes, firing blindly into places with autmatic weapons and grenades, etc. Again, this isnt calling our people the enemy-this is about making sure what Americans do is a cut above what the bad guys do. Again you equate criticism of our actions or even admitting the truth about what we did to be unAmerican. I imagine you would be the first to call someone a squealer for turning in a terrorist then?

"Yea sounds like the kind of hero you would stand behind."

@@@@@ Well its a lot harder to cheer on someone for standing up to the government than it is to cheer the government on. Just ask the millions of Germans who supported Hitler and the Nazis. They could have stood up to Hitler and stopped the holocaust-but that would have been unpatriotic.

"As for Iraq. If we were to leave, are we going back?"

@@@@@ Well gee. We left Vietnam, stopping the murder of over 50K US troops and ending a massive waste of money and guess what happened? We now have a good customer for our products and good relations-and oh yeah, they are communist-just like China-the real home of WalMart. Maybe in 10 years we can go to Iraq and make millions of dollars selling them stuff instead of killing them.....just like Vietnam.

"Now let's address the subject of just Christians are Republicans."

@@@@@ Where did I say that? I assume a number of devil worshippers are in the upper ranks of the RNC-deception and greed are the hallmarks of RNC heroes. The Christians are the vote the RNC counts on-people who have been brainwashed to believe two things-1, that the Republicans will eventually outlaw abortion and 2, that the Republicans will eventually outlaw gay marriage (and add to this a host of other extremist right wing social programs and agendas which amout to the goal of having the Bible replace our laws in the end). Basically the Christians are brainwashed to believe that democrats are all supporting a lawless world where sex is happening every 30 seconds with everyone and everything possible and that abortion will be the main method of birth control. Simply put, EVERY person I know who has had an abortion was a republican and the abortion was done because they wanted a career before kids-convenience. I know plenty of people who got pregnant before they wanted to and they had the kids-its amazing what actually being in the situation does to the convictions people claim to have.

" You'er wrong again, I have many friends that are Athiest like me that belong to the Republican party. Although I belong to no party, many of my Christian friends would wecome me to their party. Now do you have a thing agianst Christians too?"

@@@@@ Well I dont really have a "thing" against Christians, but I do hate hipporacy and both Christians and the Republicans happen to have plenty of that. You would soon realize if you knew me that I am a very Christian person in life and action-I just dont make it a point to force my views on religion on others or act contrary to my beliefs. I have plenty of friends who are republicans too-they know damn well they dont hold up to their own dictates-get a few beers into them and they are chasing anything in a skirt and breaking every social value they claim to support. Like the radical Muslims, they want to make the law enfore their values because they cant do it themselves (like the men in Islam making the women cover themselves from head to toe because they cant control their sexual urges).

" Also if you look at both the House and Senate, both parties have about the same number of color, sex and age serving. Sexual orientations I will concede the Dems win hands down.

@@@@@ Oh come now-there are plenty of gay republicans but they hide it....,"wide stance" ring a bell? And you wont find too many people of color either-its hard to work for people who see you as inferior and only bring you out as a token like they did to poor Colin Powell-he was ripshit when he found out he presented a bunch of bullshit to congress and the UN about Iraq-note he resigned.

"You made the statement " the RNC hasn't offerred anything new ". Can you show me were the DNC has?"

@@@@@ Pulling out of Iraq. Tax credits and job training for men who pay their child support instead of running away, universal health care, increasing the taxes on the wealthiest Americans who made out under Bush as our national debt went to new heights, alternative energy exploration vs more oil drilling, protection of the rights of women to their choice of an abortion if they want one, more benefits for veterans instead of cutting them. Plenty more on the website too. Just a few. McCain wants to keep us in Iraq ad infinitum and in fact wants to spend even more on the war, he wants to keep us on oil and add the USA to the drilling zone, he wants to give the rich more tax breaks than they already have. Deny any of that-I dare you.

"You also claim that Obamas church had several white members. So what. I know many people who feel by hating thier own kind will bring peace and harmony."

@@@@@ Actually the people who go there claim it is because it is a more spiritual church-about Jesus, love and forgiveness and joy vs fire and brimstone church that uses fear of hell and punishment. Race really isnt the factor. The Rev Wright is one of several ministers there and he survived the civil rights movement as a black in the south-he feels the US government allowed the oppression of blacks to continue via segregation and lack of enforcement of civil rights laws in the south and he is correct about that (criticism of the US government is NOT anti American). He doesnt hate white people-he hates racist white people and the way the US government allowed them to run things well after the civil war. But hey, just keep that single example of one angry speech and tell yourself that all he did for 20 years is talk about that. I bet I could find a couple statements you made that you arent proud of (or are) and play them over and over again and you would remind me that you said and did a lot more than that in two decades-but hey why play fair right?

" Sorry it won't Had McCain belong to a church 20 or so years that preached that blacks should be slaves agian even if there were some black that also attened this church, I am very certain that you would say that McCain was a bigot."

@@@@@@ Actually I can do better than that. McCain once stated that John Hagee and other extreme right wing ministers who preach anti-gay and anti Jewish and anti liberal stuff (generally demonizing all things liberal in a religious way so that it goes way beyond politics-many of these guys equate being liberal with being in leauge with satan) and McCain openly called these people "agents of intolerance" back in 2000. Today, McCain calls them his base and his loyal supporters-taking their money and giving speeches to their flocks of hateful and venomous supporters. Look up Hagee and you will see what I mean-the guy is a hateful nutjob.

"But unlike you, I would agree."

@@@@@ No you would not. You would make up excuses and lies as you have done throughout your posts.

And like you- I too am a WHITE guy who works for a living.

@@@@@ Works? If you call watching others work work I guess......

" Unlike you, thanks to my Democrat Governor who gave the largest taxe hike in the history of my State to small business ( the kind of person the Democrats take for granted ) I'm going out of business."

@@@@@@ Well see a tax hike wont target small business-only high incomes. In my experience small business usually doesnt make a high income without things like hiring illegal aliens and curring corners in bad ways. I doubt anyone in the dem party is putting legit small business in trouble. I also bet if you look at your cost for fuel and such that the cost of doing business went way up compared to your taxes, courtesy if the Bush policies which have gas out of control and everything associated with it. How many small business customers now mow their own lawns because they dont have the money to hire landscapers anymore for example. It sure is easy to blame taxes, but we both know that the republicans raised the cost of living over 20% in the last 8 years-people are losing jobs, people are losing houses at record rates too. Look around you and blame the democrats and taxes if you can-it just doesnt fly.

"BTW, not only am I F-cked, but so are the people who once worked for me"

@@@@@@ Back to Mexico with them I guess. Did you give your workers health insurance? At least the dems will give the taxpayers that much for their taxes.

So now you are saying that Hitler is was smarter then McCain. Is because McCain dosn't want to kill off the Jews or somthing like that? Is that what you are thinking now? What are you a Jew hater too? What a hyporite you are, as if you know what high-ground means.

In 1971, John Kerry testiomony in front of the Senate Foreign Relations Committe he compared those who served in Vietnam to the army of Genghis Khan. He also stated that they were committing War Crimes such as rape and baby-killing on a day to day basis. He said the same thing on the Dick Cavett Show, Meet the Press and other forums in 1971. When asked to provide any specific examlpes he was unable too. He recently said about the same about our arm-forces in Iraq.

He is also a hero to the Vietcong, as his photo is displayed in the war Remnats Museum in Ho Chi Minh City. It is part of an exhibit honoring heroes who helped the Vietnamese Communist win the War against the United States. Yea your kind of hero.

I was wrong when it came to 4 Purple Hearts. He only had three. His first tour was on the Gridley, although it was in what was considered a " Fighting Zone" ( less then 5 weeks ), it was far off the coast of Vietnam. It never saw action when Kerry was on the guided-missle frigate. One thing Kerry wasn't doing was intel work.

He's about the only one that I know of that received 3 Purple Hearts in less then 4 months of actual duty in Vietnam. This tour he served from Mid-November of 1968 to March 17, 1969. His first Purple Heart was a self-inflicted wound that was caused by firing an M-79 grenade to close to his boat. This life-threatening wound was a piece of metal about one centimeter long ( less then 1/2 of an inch ) and about 2 - 3 millimeters in diameter. The good Dr. Letson used tweezers to remove the tiny fragment and covered it with a band-aid. He wondered why Kerry was even there. Kerry's Commander " Grant Hibbard ", turned down Kerrys Purple Heart. Your trouble RML is, ther is just too much documentation on Kerry. Nice try.

I am glade you brought up this Congress, they have a worse overall rating then Bush. Plus the fact that Bush used the intelligence that was provided from the Clinton's adminstration. After all, didn't good ol Bill think that the aspirin factory in Iraq was a WOMD factory. Or was it the stain that he left on someones dress?

But you are right by saying when we left Vietnam we didn't go back. But like Vietnam I'm sure when we leave Iraq, there will be a killing field there too. That being said, isn't this our second time back in Iraq? To think we won't be back there agian is just nuts.

" they promise to be anti anyone who doesn't fit their concept of the perfect America including anyone who isn't christian,"

If this dose not imply that Republicans are just christians, I don't know what dose.

You still haven't shown me were the DNC has offerred anything new. Just the same old rhetoric. Tax credits and job training for men who pay their child support have been offered by the Republicans for year just to be voted down by the DNC. There is nothing new about Universal Health Care. Hilary tried to get it over 15 years ago, and it wasn't a new subject then either. Now who is going to pay for it? There's nothing new about increasing taxes on the wealthiest Americans. This is just another way of saying you are just too stupid to know that you have encreased taxes on yourself. All they will do is pass the taxes back to us by increasing the cost of thier products. Such as oil, cars or anything that sells. How about no more taxes?

Yes isn't it great that we can't drill for oil because of assholes like you? Used to be before the alternative energy craze gas was cheap and so was food. No where has alternative energy helped this country. All it has done is allow China to become our competitor. Now the world is hungery and I have to choose gas or food.

Nothing new of protecting the women's right to kill her child either, why even a terrorist has more rights.

If you want to try something new, then make the women be responsible for her child if she keeps it and leave the male out of it. After all, if only she has the right to either kill or keep the child then she alone should responsible for that child. No one else.

Nothing new of when we are at War that the DNC wants to tuck their tails and run.

Did I do a good job denying any of your f..king claims?

Ther is also a difference between a person going to a church that preaches hatered towards white people for 20 or so years then being associated with JohnHagee once or twice. Rev Wright has made that statment more then once. In fact if he didn't sell his videos that had these speaches in them we may have never known.

Obama did not leave this church because he felt they were wrong in doing this, he left it to get media attention off the chruch. McCain condemend and distance himself from Hagee once he heard what Hagee said.

As for my work habits, " fuck yourself in the ass ", you arrogant fuck-face. I live in MIchigan, owned a Heating and Cooling business. Never hired ill-legals, am against giveing them the same right we have, the party you belong to wants to give the same rights and more. They also want to give them your supposedly free health care too.

Just because you walk to your mailbox to get your welfare check RML and may have to drive to the bank to cash it dose not mean you work for a living. Why are you so pissed off about the Republicans, did they reduce your Food Stamps.

I haven't had health insurance for 20 years. If you want to try something new, try to get the DNC to agree that no one should pay taxes on health insurance.

So now you are saying that Hitler is was smarter then McCain. Is because McCain dosn't want to kill off the Jews or somthing like that?

##### Hitler was smarter than McCain. This doesnt mean I support Hitler. But being a conservative you cannot understand relative thinking (except when you screw your sister). See idiot, McCain is a moron-he admits he got shot down stupidly in Vietnam and he was involved with a massive messup on his carrier too. The man was at the bottm of his graduating class and he only passed because his daddy was an Admiral. Get a clue moron. I dont hate Jews because I think Hitler was smart-the man had the most dangerous threat to this planet ever posed and it took most of the planet to stop him--he was smart but he was also insane and quite evil. Get it?

"Is that what you are thinking now? What are you a Jew hater too? What a hyporite you are, as if you know what high-ground means."

##### I know more than a stupid plumber like you. But hey if you didnt realize you can write off your health insurance maybe YOU are the Jew hater. Go get an accountant moron.

"In 1971, John Kerry testiomony in front of the Senate Foreign Relations Committe he compared those who served in Vietnam to the army of Genghis Khan. He also stated that they were committing War Crimes such as rape and baby-killing on a day to day basis."

##### This was all true and is true. Armies throughout history have done these things. Does it mean that every soldier was doing it? Nope. The point is that in a needless war these things go on and dont have to.

" He said the same thing on the Dick Cavett Show, Meet the Press and other forums in 1971. When asked to provide any specific examlpes he was unable too. He recently said about the same about our arm-forces in Iraq."

###### If I asked you to name every specific case of Muslims murdering Americans could you do it? There were documented cases of every charge Kerry made-he was talking about a general condition. You do understand the difference right?

"He is also a hero to the Vietcong, as his photo is displayed in the war Remnats Museum in Ho Chi Minh City. It is part of an exhibit honoring heroes who helped the Vietnamese Communist win the War against the United States. Yea your kind of hero."

###### So what? Did Kerry volunteer that? Kerry was trying to keep Americans from getting killed for nothing-his goal wasnt to make the North Vietnamese the winners-that was a side affect and PROOF that the South Vietnamese people didnt support the American puppett in power-without the US troops there was no more south vietnam-just vietnam. In other words, unless US troops were there the will of the people in Vietnam was to be communist. Had the British installed a US King and used British troops to support his power would that king remain if the troops left? Nope. Kerry was a hero and saved many US lives like it or not.

"I was wrong when it came to 4 Purple Hearts. He only had three. His first tour was on the Gridley, although it was in what was considered a " Fighting Zone" ( less then 5 weeks ), it was far off the coast of Vietnam. It never saw action when Kerry was on the guided-missle frigate. One thing Kerry wasn't doing was intel work. He's about the only one that I know of that received 3 Purple Hearts in less then 4 months of actual duty in Vietnam. This tour he served from Mid-November of 1968 to March 17, 1969. His first Purple Heart was a self-inflicted wound that was caused by firing an M-79 grenade to close to his boat. This life-threatening wound was a piece of metal about one centimeter long ( less then 1/2 of an inch ) and about 2 - 3 millimeters in diameter. The good Dr. Letson used tweezers to remove the tiny fragment and covered it with a band-aid. He wondered why Kerry was even there. Kerry's Commander " Grant Hibbard ", turned down Kerrys Purple Heart. Your trouble RML is, ther is just too much documentation on Kerry. Nice try."

####### Now how about that Silver Star asshole! Wanna show that he faked that with your documentation? Good luck because the special forces people he rescued are on record calling him a hero. You are just like moron Bush--pick only the data that supports your lies and then try to sucker people into thinking it is the truth because they never saw the rest of the story. As to the shrapnel only being 2-3 CM, why dont you catch some shrapnel instead of sitting at home listening to Rush the druggie.

"I am glade you brought up this Congress, they have a worse overall rating then Bush."

###### FALSE. Individual members of congress may have bad ratings but on a case by case basis the liberals replacing the moron republicans dont.

"Plus the fact that Bush used the intelligence that was provided from the Clinton's adminstration."

###### Funny but that information didnt cause Clinton to start a war. Why not? Maybe because Clinton looked at ALL the information and realized there was no need to go to war in Iraq. Bush stacked the deck and kept a lot of information out of the report given to congress. He was then asked to go before congress to explain and he refused to do it unless he was first promised he would not need to testify under oath (afraid of perjury charges no doubt-truthful people dont make this demand)

" After all, didn't good ol Bill think that the aspirin factory in Iraq was a WOMD factory. Or was it the stain that he left on someones dress?"

###### To this day Clinton maintains the attack had nothing to do with his affair. At the time of the attack it certainly didnt distract anyone. I would also remind you that Clinton remained over 60% positive approval even when the republicans spent over 70 million dollars of your tax dollars to prove he got a blowjob. That was money well spent you think?

"But you are right by saying when we left Vietnam we didn't go back."

###### We didnt need to go back. Now we make millions there doing business with those "commies" instead of dropping napalm on their kids. Funny isnt it? Instead of spending 13 billion a month and getting our troops killed we could be making millions in Iraq by letting them run their own damn country.....

"But like Vietnam I'm sure when we leave Iraq, there will be a killing field there too."

####### Over 500 people a month die in Iraq today with the "surge" in place. It aint from old age asshole. It is because they are having a civil war. When we leave (and we will) the real war will be fought and concluded without 13 Billion dollars from our tax dollars and then we will buy oil there and all will be as it was. A new religious nuttie will take his place in power and he will thank the US for killing Saddam so a religious nuttie could replace him.

"That being said, isn't this our second time back in Iraq? To think we won't be back there agian is just nuts."

####### Well Gee Fucwad isnt this a second Bush back to finish Daddys work because daddy wouldnt take out his cash cow in Iraq (Saddam was on our payroll you idiot). When Saddam stopped playing ball we went to war. Until then he was an "allie" in the Bush war against Iran. We gave Saddam money, weapons, and satellite intelligence. There is even a nice photo of Saddam shaking hands with Rummsfeld over some missile sales.

" they promise to be anti anyone who doesn't fit their concept of the perfect America including anyone who isn't christian,"

If this dose not imply that Republicans are just christians, I don't know what dose.

######### Oh please. Go to a Klan meeting and ask anyone who isnt christian and republican to stand up.....chirp chirp chirp (crickets). ALL Republicans are either Christian or militant Jews looking for more aid for Israel.

"You still haven't shown me were the DNC has offerred anything new. Just the same old rhetoric."

##### McCain wants to keep us in Iraq and drill more oil in the USA. This is new how?

Yes isn't it great that we can't drill for oil because of assholes like you? Used to be before the alternative energy craze gas was cheap and so was food. No where has alternative energy helped this country. All it has done is allow China to become our competitor. Now the world is hungery and I have to choose gas or food.

###### Whaddaya want moron? WalMart has their products made in China dirt cheap and you buy them there so naturaly China wants gas and food. The rednecks made China into a powerhouse-not the dems. We only buy at exclusive hippie stores right? Not Wal-Mart......If you listened to Jimmy Carter back in the 70's the first time our "allies" Saudi Arabia fucked us you would have developed new energy sources-instead we let Bush and the oil men keep us sucking the Saudi dick. Now you get what you voted for-more dick (cheney).

"Nothing new of protecting the women's right to kill her child either, why even a terrorist has more rights."

###### Tell ya what moron. Sign a statement saying you will personally adopt, pay all associated medical, food, and clothing costs, educated, and support every unwanted child born in order to stop abortion.....(chirp chirp chirp). A lot easier to just put them in jail later right?

"If you want to try something new, then make the women be responsible for her child if she keeps it and leave the male out of it. After all, if only she has the right to either kill or keep the child then she alone should responsible for that child. No one else."

####### Do you honestly believe most of these unwanted kids would be born if the male could have a say? Sorry chump but most women who have abortions do it with money from the father or because the father is useless and couldnt support her and the baby.

"Nothing new of when we are at War that the DNC wants to tuck their tails and run."

######## Run from WHAT? Where is the army of Muslims coming to invade us? Where is their navy? Where is their air force? We are pissing 13 BILLION a month into Iraq and it hasnt saved a single US civilian. We havent "won" the war there and it is has been longer than it took us to win WWII (with a dem president). WHAT are YOU afraid of tool?

"Did I do a good job denying any of your f..king claims?"

###### No. It was kind of pathetic to be honest with you.

"Ther is also a difference between a person going to a church that preaches hatered towards white people for 20 or so years then being associated with JohnHagee once or twice.

###### No. Wright was discussing the US tolerance of racism, he wasnt preaching hatred. Not one thing he said speaks of hating white people. In fact, it speaks of the US tolerating bad behavoir-like we did when we financed Saddam and Osama Bin Laden. If anything, Wright inspired Obama to run in order to bring change to our policies. McCain took on John Hagee for his money AFTER stating that Hagee was an "agent of intolerance". That is like you calling me evil and then asking me to be your running mate.

" Rev Wright has made that statment more then once. In fact if he didn't sell his videos that had these speaches in them we may have never known."

##### Give it up jerk. Do you have OBAMA saying anything like Wright said? No? Then you got NOTHING.

"Obama did not leave this church because he felt they were wrong in doing this, he left it to get media attention off the chruch.

###### Good point. Who wants to have the media all over your church?

"McCain condemend and distance himself from Hagee"

###### In 2000 he sure did. That is when he called him an "agent of intolerance". THAT is when he refused Hagees money and support the FIRST time.

"once he heard what Hagee said.

####### Actually scrotum sucker McCain sought Hagee's support in 2008. He knew what Hagee was in 2000. So here we are 8 years later and suddenly Hagee is a nice guy? How do you call someone a hate monger in 2000 and a symbol of Christian values in 2008? Either McCain is an idiot or he is a hippocrite.

"As for my work habits, " fuck yourself in the ass ", you arrogant fuck-face. I live in MIchigan, owned a Heating and Cooling business."

###### You live in a state with massive unemployment. What has Bush done for Michigan? Oh yeah, I saw how good the auto companies are doing. Maybe if McCain gets in we can just let the Japanese take over the plants right? Heat and cool your fine Chinese made everything. I bet you paid your help as little as possible and gave them no health insurance-a typical republican-so cheap you wont pay for anything and will probably ask your money to get buried with you.

"Never hired ill-legals, am against giveing them the same right we have,"

###### I doubt you never hired illegals. How would you know since you probably paid cash to avoid paying insurance and unemployment.

" the party you belong to wants to give the same rights and more."

##### You know I cant find that anywhere on the DNC website. Got a link for me?

"They also want to give them your supposedly free health care too."

###### Please show me the reference where democrats state our plan to give illegal aliens free health care. I cant fins that but I was able to find where Republicans want to let them in and document them so they can steal our jobs by working for peanuts at those jobs we dont want to do (the reality of course being we wont work for shit wages you want to pay us).

"Just because you walk to your mailbox to get your welfare check RML and may have to drive to the bank to cash it dose not mean you work for a living."

##### You dont know me. I work over 60 hours per week, I have at times worked three jobs to keep the bills paid in fact. I have NEVER been on welfare. Not once. Sorry to say that most republicans I know dont turn down their social security check or their unemployment benefits. Those that I know who used their vet status to get postal jobs all belong to the union too. It seems that they like to bitch about liberals and programs but make damn sure they use them too.

" Why are you so pissed off about the Republicans, did they reduce your Food Stamps."

###### Republicans lied to start wars and fuck the working people every chance they get. I have yet to see a single republican do anything for the people of this country but make sure we die faster and with less each time. Notice Bush tried to kill social security by handing it to Wall Street so they could steal it? Notice how now Wall Street is being nailed for scams and bullshit numbers? That could have been you social security going down with Bear Stearns if Bush has been successful. Greed and war is all you bring to this country.

"I haven't had health insurance for 20 years."

###### How proud you must be. So I can count on you to not use your Medicare/Medicaid right? I mean you dont need government sponsored health care.

" If you want to try something new, try to get the DNC to agree that no one should pay"

####### As I told you before jerk you have been able to write off your health insurance costs for YEARS. If you dont have health insurance that is your problem. Just dont ask me to pay your bills with my taxes unless I can have the same health insurance you do.

And who's fagots ass did you crawl from? You think that Hitler was " smart ", even though he killed 6 million Jews, countless of other nationalities ( such as about 2 million Polish people ), destroyed his own people and country. I wouldn't call him smart, I would call him mad. No I guess being of more conservative in nature I don't understand your relative thinking. Even though I am an atheist, " Thank God ". No I don't, never had or will have sex with my sister. But it's good to know that you are having an understanding of reative thinking towards your sister, up until now I just thought you were just a " Horse Fucker ". At least now you are thinking of having sex with people ( even if it is your own sister ) instead of animals. Hope your sister can get you out of the pasture. Never said I was a plumber ( You know, Heating and Cooling Contractor ). And you think your not stupid, what a surprise. As for insurance, can't deduct, and yes I have an accountant fuck face. Let's talk about Kerry's Silver Star, Just as much controversy as to how he was awarded it too. It's just that your " relative thinking " dose not alow your wishful superior intellect to go beyond the first grade. Kerry was going to sue the Swift Boat Veterans who spoke out against him. He found out that it's not wise to sue people who were telling the truth, for this would only harm his career even more. As for individual members of congress. You'r full of shit ( may be why you want a horse to fuck you in the ass? ) gas was $2.19 before congress went Democratic, now it's $4.25, they have a + approval rating of 9 compaired to Bushes approval rating of 36. Eat shit. Clinton lied in court and he lied to the people of this country. What else did he lie about? He also gave China favorite Nation Statist ( may be why Wal-Mart can buy goods from China Fuck Face ) along with the knowledge to send nuclear war heads our way. No wonder you think that Hitler was smart. To show what an idiot you are. Yes you are right, this is the second Bush. But Horse fucker, did you forget that he has brothers? You see unlike you, I can admit that Bush is an asshole just like you. But you could never admit that the man who lied to the people of this country ( I didn't have sex with that woman Clinton ) was. So much for your superior thinking. As for the Rev Wright, I have a copy of his video, no he wasn't discussing the US tolerance of racism ( like why can't the whites have White Miss America but the Blacks can have Black Miss America? ), he was claiming that white people were the one's to give the blacks aides, and damming white Americans. He is a bigot and so are you. No way have you ever worked 60 hours per week. You are too much of a cry baby for that. At best you probably slept 60 hours per week and then complained that you work too hard. I know assholes like you. At the end of the day you go home and play with yourself and couldn't give a fuck about work. You are probably a first rate example of let the other person worry about the shit you produced instead of trying to make it right to begin with. In short, you are a horse fucking asshole.

You CAN deduct your insurance costs. Get a COMPETENT accountant instead of trying to run Quickbooks while drunk.

Bush is the liar.

Clinton lied about something you had no business knowing.

And Hitler was smart and EVIL. Too bad he missed your parents.

Ive worked more hours than you can stay awake and what I do isnt easy. I see ads for "heating and cooling" techs on late night TV. I imagine Sally Struthers sent you that brochure right? Course it explains why you still think you cant write off your insurance.

Bush=Lied to start a war

Reagan=Iran-Contra

Nixon=Watergate.

The Republican party is the biggest criminal organization in the country.