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Say it ain't so?
by Textualist

I am not concerned with the amount of reversals so much as the degree of reversals. There has been a history of 9-0 and 8-1 reversals of the 9th circuit. I wonder if the author could look into it?

For instance for 9-0:

WASHINGTON et al. v. GLUCKSBERG LUJAN V. G & G FIRE SPRINKLERS, INC. I will look up some more but it seems there are quite a few.

Re: Say it ain't so?
by Textualist
Textualist:

I am not concerned with the amount of reversals so much as the degree of reversals. There has been a history of 9-0 and 8-1 reversals of the 9th circuit. I wonder if the author could look into it?

For instance for 9-0:

WASHINGTON et al. v. GLUCKSBERG LUJAN V. G & G FIRE SPRINKLERS, INC. I will look up some more but it seems there are quite a few.

Additions since 12/11/06 at 9-0 reverse or remand:

Docket # - Beginning word (sorry, copy method not working)

05-1429 - Travelers...

05-595 Whorton...

05-381 Weyerhaeuser...

05-9222 Burton...

05-785 Carey...

..

Why is that a problem?
by degsme

Why is that a problem?

Note also that the 9th Circuit is about 40% conservative appointees. Which actually OVERREPRESENTS conservative political presence in that jurisdiction.

Re: Why is that a problem?
by Textualist
degsme:

Why is that a problem?

Note also that the 9th Circuit is about 40% conservative appointees. Which actually OVERREPRESENTS conservative political presence in that jurisdiction.

In "Election 2004", Bush got 45% of the vote in California (42% in 2000) which I assume based on population and "liberalness" is not a conservative representation of the 9th Circuit. The court is 40% appointed by Republicans (conservative?). Your assertion that conservatives are OVERREPRESENTED in the jurisdiction does not hold water.

45% of the population that voted
by degsme

45% of the population that voted (roughly 65% of those eligible and something like 55% of the population). That's awfully small beer. And this as a sitting "war president". The only "war" president to do worse was LBJ.

Re: 45% of the population that voted
by Textualist
I also posted "Election 2000" (BEFORE THE WAR) result of 42% Bush which you glazed over; wonder why? Explanation without pure conjecture?
Re: Say it ain't so?
by CullenS

Good question and a good idea. Thanks for posting.

It would be interesting to see how often Circuits are affirmed or reversed by large majorities of the Supreme Court. That analysis gets a little complicated because even in cases where there is, say, a 7-2 vote, the seven Justices in the majority may concur only in a result but write separate opinions explaining how they got there, leaving the rest of us to wonder which of several rationales will really represent the view of the Court when the next case comes around. Furman v. Georgia, which overturned capital punishment in this country before Gregg v. Georgia outlined how it could be restored three years later, resulted in numerous opinions that makes, to this day, Eighth Amendment analysis enormously complex.

Another factor that makes vote counting analyses difficult is that the role of the Supreme Court is to set precedent and not to correct error. I think the consensus view is that if all a litigant has to hang his hat on in is that a great injustice was done, the Supreme Court will almost certainly not take the case. The Supreme Court's Rules specifically prescribe that petitions for appeal are granted based primarily on how important a precedent will be set by the case. The Court looks most often to conflicts between and among the federal Courts of Appeals and the highest courts of the states and to whether an important federal question has been raised that needs addressing by the Supreme Court. All of which is to say that looking at the rate of Supreme Court reversal isn't a very good gauge of lower courts' error rates since the Supreme Court is not set up, in that Court's view, to simply correct errors - it is set up to set precedent and make law.

Thanks again for posting!

Cullen

uhuh and how does that help?
by degsme

Uhuh and how does that help? 42% of a 57% turnout - which heavily skewed elderly (65%) means 24% support for GWB in CA. And that means that in the youth vote (18-24), which had roughly a 37% turnout, Bush at best managed to get a "mandate" from a whopping 16%.

Yeah that's some mandate.

And we all know how conservative West Coasters are - how principled in their adherence to conservative values like

  • low divorce rates
  • intolerance of taxation
  • intolerance of business regulation
  • intolerance of mandated healthcare
  • low single parenthood rates

Yeah, conservative values really do command 40% of that region.. uhuh.

Another Ingenuous Post
by TheRanger

Gee, if we use your logic, the Democrats "swept" the last by a similar small number. Thus the mandate for the Democrats to do anything is equally invalid.

I don't know how to break the news to you but being a Republican does not equate to being conservative in CA. Point and case; Gov. Arnold S. Hardly a staunch conservative.

What else is ignored is that the 9th Circuit is made up of 49 judges. A panel may be as few as 3 judges. That leaves a lot of room for certain biases; e.g., the 9th Circuit brags about an all Hispanic panel of judges. Why is that important if all the judges are equal? Some must be more equal than others. How many of these wild decisions are from the same judges? Shopping for judges is not unknown in jurisprudence including where you file federal suits. This is particularly a tactic in mass torts.

Re: uhuh and how does that help?
by Textualist
degsme:

Uhuh and how does that help? 42% of a 57% turnout - which heavily skewed elderly (65%) means 24% support for GWB in CA. And that means that in the youth vote (18-24), which had roughly a 37% turnout, Bush at best managed to get a "mandate" from a whopping 16%.

Yeah that's some mandate.

And we all know how conservative West Coasters are - how principled in their adherence to conservative values like

  • low divorce rates
  • intolerance of taxation
  • intolerance of business regulation
  • intolerance of mandated healthcare
  • low single parenthood rates

Yeah, conservative values really do command 40% of that region.. uhuh.

1. Where did I say "mandate"? I said he lost but got 42% of vote vs. 40% of appointees by Republicans.

2. How do you speak for those who didn't vote?

3. Old people are people, too. They represent America just like the "18-24 age group". Besides, "CNN Election 2000" exit poll has the highest percentage for Gore at 71% for "60 & older". In short, your post hoc theories even make no sense.

4. Your powers of inductive logic are shaky and your powers of deductive logic are...

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