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Apples and Oranges
by brerlou

All my sympathies go to the double amputee, that doesn't however rebut the fact that running with artificial limbs is a different discipline from running with natural limbs. It's comparing apples and oranges. He has to call upon different musculature, balance, timing, and on and on.

This is a problem similar to the problem dealt with in horse racing which is handled by classifying and handicapping. I'm not sure how this is handled at the paralympics, but I'm sure it's a problem there as well. Because of the coincidence of the calendar and the benefit of superior coaching I found myself in school classrooms as a 9 year old with boys up to 2 years older than myself. No one bothered to tell me that I could not be expected to compete with classmates that much older than myself, so I decided at an early age that I wasn't cut out for athletics. Maybe I was right, but I sure would like to have taken a shot at it. This was only the beginning of my life experiences with the damage done by unfair comarisons. Hence my interest.

For once I agree whole-heartedly with Saletan. The fact that someone running with bionic assistance presently is achieving times comparable to those of olympic athletes is irrelevant, to Olympic competition that is. As I said over the unfair criticism of Mrs Obama's thesis writing at the age of 21, (if she's reporting her age correctly), "the wonder is not that she is writing her thesis well but that she is writing a thesis at the age of 21 at all."

Same here, the wonder is not that he is beating olympic level atheletes but that he is able to run so well at all, but it is a different discipline. Soon with mechanical and engineering modifications we can expect that he will be beating the times of the fastest athletes. If Ben Johnson's times in the 100 metres were struck down, for his biochemical engineering assistance, so should this guy's times for his mechanical assistance.

Re: Apples and Oranges
by patron002
Ok, but a person with naturally long legs, and a naturally thin body might have a huge advanatage over me, they are built differently and likely use their muscles differently. Also, Americans get every advantage in the technology bracket anyway, we have better treadmills, better supplements, better coaches, better education, better everything (as does China) Do you really want to pretend that the guys from poor nations are on equal footing with us rich nations? If you really want a fair olympics, you'd need to eliminate all of that, Americans using technology to create monster legs is not the same discipline as natural running, without the advantage of special technology and knowledge. I say let the guy run, I only have on reservation, I don't want to encourage nut cases to mutilate their bodies in an attempt to win, or worst, nut case leaders cutting up their citizens in an attempt to make the perfect running/ boxing/ jumping/ ect machine. That is the only real reason that I would have any concern about it. Otherwise let the guy race, if the Olympics really want to make sure that its fair, it should be their responsibility to create artificial limbs that meet their criteria. I would have more sympathy for Olympic athletes if they weren't cheating to get every advantage that they can get, as it stands I have zero sympathy for them, the ones that do it the right way aren't in the olympics anyway....
Re: Apples and Oranges
by Iapetus
"Do you really want to pretend that the guys from poor nations are on equal footing with us rich nations?" D'uh? When was the last time an American won a marathon or 10K meter race by beating runners from those ultra-rich countries called Ethiopia and Kenya? Do you even read the sports pages? Another person here wrote, "Who cares?" and went on to say everyone should compete. I agree , but only because I don't give a hoot about the Olympics. As an international sports spectacle, the Olympics have become a farce, each one spending more obscene amounts of money to glorify the host country. Professional athletes, drug scandals, prepubescent children competing for a few scraps of shiny medal in exchange for a normal childhood---this is how gross the Olympics have become. Who needs them? Good riddance.
Re: Apples and Oranges
by brerlou

patron002:
Ok, but a person with naturally long legs, and a naturally thin body might have a huge advanatage over me, they are built differently and likely use their muscles differently. Also, Americans get every advantage in the technology bracket anyway, we have better treadmills, better supplements, better coaches, better education, better everything (as does China) Do you really want to pretend that the guys from poor nations are on equal footing with us rich nations? If you really want a fair olympics, you'd need to eliminate all of that, Americans using technology to create monster legs is not the same discipline as natural running, without the advantage of special technology and knowledge. I say let the guy run, I only have on reservation, I don't want to encourage nut cases to mutilate their bodies in an attempt to win, or worst, nut case leaders cutting up their citizens in an attempt to make the perfect running/ boxing/ jumping/ ect machine. That is the only real reason that I would have any concern about it. Otherwise let the guy race, if the Olympics really want to make sure that its fair, it should be their responsibility to create artificial limbs that meet their criteria. I would have more sympathy for Olympic athletes if they weren't cheating to get every advantage that they can get, as it stands I have zero sympathy for them, the ones that do it the right way aren't in the olympics anyway....

Seems to me that nationaly popularity of the sport, population size and genetic physical characteristics have more to do with medal count at the Olympics and any sporting competition for that matter than has access to scientific research. I mean the Kenyans and the Ethiopians do quite well too. The Olympics has always been interesting to me, and has implications for all fields of human endeavour because it provides answers to a range of questions about individual effort and the adaptability of the human body, across the ethnic diversity of the human race.

The problem with prosthetics and doping is that they change the parameters of our comparisons, making nonsense of our records over the years. It's the same thing as the issues in baseball, how can we make comparisons between Bonds and Ruth for example if not only have the ball and the bats changed so much over the years but so has the chemistry of the players' bodies? It's not just a morality or fairness issue it is a also question of consistent comparisons. How can we be sure that Pete Rose didn't throw any games if he was betting on them?

You raised the question of healt issues. No one remembers, but doping only became a concern for the Olympics back in the 50's when a cy

Finally, if a guy with no legs can run with artificial limbs, why shouldn't a guy with weak ankles have special braces of spring steel fitted? Now what about a one-armed boxer? Couldn't we have a special arm made of cork or some synthetic material that wouldn't cut the flesh fitted to him? Where do we draw the line? No, prosthetics have to be banned across the board because we need to make consistent comparisons over the years. It's not just a question of national prestiege, it's important to the science of the human body, for the good of mankind.

Re: Apples and Oranges
by patron002
Records are all nonsense anyway brerlou, if anything has proved that, its swimming, just by wearing an expensive state of the art uniform they can cut time off of their swim. If you were really interested in comparing times across various time peroids you'd have to keep the exact same uniform, also we have learned more about what temps allow for optimal swimming which cuts time off records. Sports such as Ice Skating, are nothing but nonsense anyway where Judges pick their favorite rather than any sort of actual contest rules. Technology has always been a part of the olympics, pretending otherwise is just that, pretending. In the 80's Americans and Russians alike pumped their athletes full of drugs, now we make fancy uniforms, contacts, and supplements. Its every evolving, and frankly I've seen him run on those legs, he's not getting an advantage.
Re: Apples and Oranges
by TJA

"Also, Americans get every advantage in the technology bracket anyway, we have better treadmills, better supplements, better coaches, better education, better everything (as does China) Do you really want to pretend that the guys from poor nations are on equal footing with us rich nations?"

Tell that to the Kenyans. Your argument is empty. Should you have to race someone in a car? Why not? Artificial locomotion is all the same thing, just in varying degrees.

Re: Apples and Oranges
by brerlou
We'll see. It's just that I hate to see another of our precious few ideals go by the board. Yesterday it was the meaning of marriage, next day the meaning of fair competition. What the hell is Marion Jones in jail for then, if we can alter sporting conventions simply because no one could have thought to make a rule to block certain changes?
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