it says very clearly in the bible that 'gluttony' is one of the 7 deadly sins.

fat people marry. My girlfriend and I are a size 4

so get over it.

That's the most ridiculous statement I've read so far.

The only thing that's rediculous about it is the fact that it's true. The bible says a LOT of crap that we ignore... I direct you to www.evilbible.com

Do women who're menstruating have to go off on their own for 7 days due to their "impurity"? No... the woman could be sitting next to you on a bus... you could touch her and become contaminated by her impurity because she just stuffed tissue into her sacred space and donned an apron to work at Starbucks for the day. Gross.

Or kosher laws... or laws regarding fabric woven of two different materials... or laws regarding the planting of unlike crops next to eachother... it's crazy what we will ignore because it doesn't suit us, but then we will damn someone with another verse.

Gluttony is a sin as well, but you missed the point. A sin is a sin is a sin. And there will be a punishment for every sin committed in this world. We All will have to answer to a higher authority someday. I'm not judging anybody, but God will.

Did you read the one about Pride coming before a fall? And only the fool says there is no God? I suppose you are also one of those gender confused souls who likes to pick and choose what laws the bible gave us to use to live by right? Like thou shall not kill, steal or covet what someone else has. I am sure you have brought more heartache to your parents then anyone can imagine and could care less, you just seem like that kind of selfish person from your post just a guess though. What you are living is an Imitation of Life.

I will just continue to pray for those that have fallen prey or who have had such dysfunction in their childhoods to cause them to deny their own identity.

Did you read the one about "judge not lest ye be judged, for the judgement you lay upon another's head shall be laid upon your own"? That's from Matthew...

I'm glad you admitted that it was just a guess... 'cause a guess can be right or wrong, you won't know, because you refuse to know me. How sad that YOU, sir (or madam) had something in your childhood that made you incapable of seeing the humanity in everyone around you, not just those who agree with you.

First of all, you should KNOW the bible yourself and the truth of if before referencing it for YOUR very INACCURATE ARGUMENT:

there is no place in the Word of God that 'seven' sins are plainly listed as being the 'seven deadly sins'. The bible clearly instructs us to not sin and how not to sin and describes to us what sin is. But the 'seven deadly sins' were unfortunately man's attempt to categorize and/or put on a points scale how a man should somehow sin but not necessarily die from doing so. But God's word states that "...the wages of sin is death"...so, no sin is described in this promise so we must infer that all sin is of equal separation of God. You cant be a little separated when you tell a lie just as you cant be alot separated if you murder. Sin is sin and all sin is contradictory to life. What has been scewed from scripture is in all liklihood, what follows:

Otherwise known as:
Lust
Gluttony
Greed
Sloth
Wrath
Envy
Pride

Proverbs 6:16–19 touches upon sin as follows:

A proud look,
a lying tongue,
and hands that shed innocent blood,
A heart that deviseth wicked imaginations,
feet that be swift in running to mischief,
A false witness that speaketh lies,
and he that soweth discord among brethren.

While there are seven of them, these sins are considerably different in outward appearance from the so-called seven deadly sins listed above (it was the Catholic church that attemtped to redefine sin and categorize sin).
The only sin which is clearly on both lists is pride.
"Hands that kill innocent people" could be taken to refer to wrath. However, it is possible to imagine a case where cold blooded murder of the innocent would be one of the "hated things" without necessarily being an example of wrath. Practices such as abortion, genocide, and euthanasia can be argued under the umbrella of "hands that shed innocent blood" as well.

The remaining five of the "deadly sins" don't have even a loose correspondence to the "hated things", even if it is easy to imagine how they might lead someone to acting in one of the ways described in "Proverbs".

As previously stated, there is no where in the Bible where the traditional "seven deadly sins" are located or listed, although they are all condemned in various parts, along with several others. These "deadly sins" are not necessarily worse than any others that are listed. The Bible makes it clear throughout its New Testament that it only takes one sin, which is an act of disobeying God's law, to separate man from a perfect God, placing him in need of redemption and salvation.

The list in Proverbs is not the only list of sins in the Bible. Proverbs does list seven sins but these are not an exhaustive listing of sins.

Another list of sins is given in the (New Testament) book of "Galatians" 5:19-21.
That list reads: (19) Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, (20) Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, (21) Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.(KJV)

PS. "gender confused souls who likes to pick and choose"? Actually, I am not beholden to the Bible any more than I am to a collection of the Grimm's Brother's fairy tales, or the Kojiki or my copy of Catcher in the Rye. I think it's a pretty book, it has some amazing literary merit, but as for a guidebook to life, it's a little too barbaric for me.

You need to study the dispensations of time, my friend. The Old Testament had an audience and a purpose the New Testament does as well. Until you understand the purpose of both books combined, you'll never understand the will of God. This is not an attack on you, please understand. There is an intended interpretation of every word in the bible and the book interprets itself and that's what makes it so special. You cant draw conclusions on one scripture. They must be read in context to time, audience and intent; whether its literal or figurative and that comes with much study of both Hebrew (old) and Greek (New). And it's a lifelong study...

I've come to the conclusion that gays want to be married because they want to convince others that being gay is not immoral. Then - if they think they have the world believing it - then maybe they can convince God of it when they die... Quoting from another person's message on this board - which I couldn't say better...I'm appalled at this social acceptance and 'rewriting' of morality. If you gave this more than a second of thought, you would have no other righteous conclusion but to say to yourselves; homosexuality does not make physical sense and therefore, certainly contradicts spiritual harmony with the Creator. What a sad world we live in! As for me and my house; we will serve the Lord!

KAJ

I agree that the old and new testaments had their particular audience and literary traditions that seat them, firmly, in the time in which they were written and they should be understood from that context. Which is why I say that I am no more beholden to them than I am to the other great works that I have mentioned. Anyone could spend the rest of their life studying any book, and I have no problem with that.

The problem happens when people try to argue things for the bible that the bible doesn't even argue for itself. Or, try to use a sophomoric (at best) reading of it to dehumanize our fellow man and woman. I hold very little issue with people of your mindset, who seem to genuinely study what you believe.

Lorna

Your conclusion is misguided. At least, in this instance. I want to get married for the same reasons my father and stepmother, or mother and stepfather (yes, both of my parents are remarried, so, I wonder which marriage's sanctity is blessed by "God" and which is not? Or, are serial marriages deemed acceptable as long as they are between one man and one woman? Where is the biblical precident for that?). Because I have fallen in love. I don't understand it, I admit that it doesn't feel "natural" but what's natural about wanting to put someone else's welfare above your own? What's "natural" about wanting someone else to be happy even if it means you being unhappy? What's "natural" about that? Nothing. There is nothing "natural" about love.

Oh, I know that people argue all the time that what my partner and I feel is not love, but just debauched lust. That it's just perversion wandering around in the tanned hides of true love which is killed and skinned when I chose this disgusting lifestyle. But, the truth of the matter is, it has little to nothing to do with sex, this bond that we have. When he is hurting, it hurts me... deep down. When his grandfather died and I saw him cry, it hurt. Likewise, when he experiences joy - a raise, the birth of a nephew, the marriage of his sister - that joy is mine as well. And vice versa. Maybe that's lust. Maybe that's debauchery. Maybe "God" will send me to an eternity of suffering a state of being cut off from him for it. In the words of my Grandmother "if that's the kind of God that runs heaven, I'd rather go to hell".

I hurt when my best friends hurt...so that's a poor argument...

Anyway, I don't like anyone to have to hurt - or go unloved! I don't hate gays! BUT it's unnatural and immoral and I shouldn't have to hear about what's going on behind your closed door - or read about it - or see it on tv!

That's not a poor argument at all. I didn't flippantly say "I hurt when my best friends hurt"... it's deeper than that.

Also, you DON'T see what's going on behind my bedroom door. Ever. Last time I checked, my personal life wasn't broadcast to the world. Nor do I want it to be. However, if a gay couple kissing onscreen, or in the newspaper is so egregiously offensive to you, you have to remember that maybe we don't want to see "what goes on behind your closed doors" anymore than you want to see what goes on behind ours.

rnbwflt... You are very well spoken, and it makes me happy knowing that soon people like us that take the side of compassion and making one's own mind up about issues will be the majority. It is much more difficult to have to actually contimplate ideas, teachings etc and come up with one's own view of the truth, than it is to hide behind a leather bound book and say "I do what this says."

Thank you DMM25. It is actually quite difficult at times to continue to hold myself to the standards I do. I have times where I want to scream and grab a handful of mud and start flinging. Thanks for the boost. :)