Go to Ask.com


enter the fray: our reader discussion forum
Search in:
Advanced
View:FlatThreaded
Page 1 of 10 (149 items)   1 2 3 4 5 Next > ... Last »
While No One Is Looking…
by Demosthenes2
+10 Reply

Our character is what we do when we think no one is looking. --H. Jackson Browne

We all get to act when nobody is looking. We vote when nobody is looking. Super Delegates make their decisions when nobody is looking.

I found it disconcerting that some voters yesterday cited false information from hoaxes as reasons not to support Obama—‘he’s a Muslim’, ‘he swore on the Koran’, ‘he hates America’. It doesn’t really seem to matter if he disavows a firebrand pastor (or for that matter that has a Christian pastor!), damned if he does and damned if he doesn’t. It’s equally dismaying that Obama frequently out polls results because some people are simply unable to publicly admit their inability to vote for a black man—and so in the voting booth avoid what they would otherwise consider the right choice. Similarly, those who claim simply to ‘hate Hillary’ for no good reason or because of her husband and those who have the sexist version of the Obama racism problem and won’t elect a woman I find repugnant. What people do in the dark.

Super delegates serve an important purpose—they’re a firewall. They are there to ensure that the Democratic party doesn’t drive off a cliff in their enthusiasm by nominating an unelectable candidate and in that regard firewalls are prudent things and there’s little harm in testing the viability of each candidate securely. There is, however, harm in the surefire undertones of racism and fear mongering to come and the not so subtle appeal to people to act… differently… and give vent to their spleen when nobody is looking.

Don’t. It’s clear that neither candidate will win on delegates alone and that one group of supporters will have their will thwarted by party leadership with the other crying the candidate is nominated is unelectable or used influence to wrest the crown away.

I give the disgruntled supporters—of either candidate—two weeks to get over yourselves. The super delegates are going to decide this and they’re going to decide it with an eye towards November. If supporters of either candidate allow themselves to idly support the opposition of what they believe or give vent to spite—to act with malice when nobody is watching—when you know that the actual policies and positions are not the difference than you lack integrity. You become that person acting differently and influenced by hoax and innuendo—when nobody is looking.

My personal belief is that the ticket ought to be fused. The super delegates will decide this and someone is going to lose. Obama has consistently lost older white, Catholics (for the first time in decades beginning to vote as a viable block) and working class voters to Hillary. Hillary consistently loses the black and more fervent left wing vote to Obama. If they can get over their differences and support what’s right for the greater good, so can you—and if they do they may well carry the voters they’ve lost in the primaries to the other. Even if it isn’t—do what you know is right and contain the spleen.

There’s a lot at stake here. Our misadventures and poor aim in identifying real threats has gutted the economy. Our debts and foolish spending weaken the dollar, create inflation and send oil soaring undermine everything from home values to credit and weaken employment and the financial sector. Our military is stretched to the breaking point. We are exposed to real danger while we pursue chimera. Our health care system is a mess and there are real environmental issues that is astoundingly irresponsible not to address along with a serious energy policy that engages all options.

This is too important for this nation to act churlish about. While I’m thankful for McCain’s service to his nation I don’t believe he has the solutions to these problems—and they are real and serious. No one of good conscience can act in concert with fear or more selfish desires or pique… simply because no one is looking.

Don’t vote against something—decide what you’re for.

To speak ill of others is a dishonest way of praising ourselves. --Will Durant

Hear, here. Or Here, here.
by DragonTat2

Here, hear? What ever the phrase is, your statement here is why you had a *. You've woven together for me all those thoughts about where this country has been the past decade or so and where the problems are. We can address these problems together; we can do nothing divided.

Thanks.

Moira ~ here.

any of clinton's supporters
by catnapping

jumping the democrat ship to vote for McCain must have their reasons...

...and after reading some of the racist shit they've posted on these forums, i honestly wouldn't be surprised to learn that this isn't one of them.

and clinton herself? well, if she allows this to go all the way to the convention...i'll be questioning her motives, as well. cuz you KNOW she has to realize what will happen if she doesn't concede to obama, soon.

in fact, if she and bill care at all about protecting our country from the wingnuts, she would do well to not only concede to obama, but to endorse and actively campaign for obama.

Candidate integrity test:
by FieldingBandolier

Obama's making statements about the importance of reconciliation and moving forward towards the general election. Offering the VP spot to Hillary would be the single most potent act he could commit to achieving this end.

Hillary presents herself as a candidate committed to serving the Republic. If Obama offers the VP spot, this would provide her with a golden opportunity to be of great service to the country, even if not in the position she desires.

Should either candidate fail to act in a manner that demonstrates their commitment to serving the greater good of the country, they will be demonstrating a lack of the integrity they purport to have, and will be doing their own part to exacerbate the party rift that so many are bemoaning these days.

It would be disappointing to see that "politics as usual" underlies the idealistic rhetoric we've been hearing from Clinton and Obama. But even in that case, the "politics as usual" of the Democratic party are vastly preferable to the "politics as usual" of the Republicans. If Democrats prove so vulnerable to divisive politicking, the party is no longer viable: not in the face of the well-demonstrated Republican party loyalty.

You know, "...divided we fall", and all that.

cat, could you do me a favor?
by mom

I'd be interested in reading those "racist" posts by legitimate Clinton supporters. Could you post a link please?

Obama could end this tomorrow...
by FieldingBandolier

by offering her the VP spot.

If he fails to do so, are you sure it's she who is "dividing the party"?

We should have more faith in the Democratic party.

What does it imply that we don't?

I'm all for him offering her the VP.
by catnapping

As long as she continues to "run" then yes, I see this is as her issue.

She cannot win. Even if Michigan and Florida's votes are included, she's already lost. She can't catch up.

Let's hope they're talking right now.

Some of them are from the old fray...
by catnapping

but I have screenshots. I can find them, upload them to photobucket, and post you a link, if you like.

In the meantime...Tempo and LaurieAnn have both used racial slurs on these boards...regarding blacks, indigenous americans, asians, and jews. lunesta/antipasto/tempo's overt slurs were only against indigenous americans; it is laurieann/nightengale/leemadis­on/jarule/jacarunda, etc who made the slurs against all of the above...not to mention her alcohol-induced homophobic rants of 2003, 04, and 05.

Even as antipasto and nightengale2, they posted a few slurs last summer...some of that stuff might be around. i know geoff deleted some of the stuff brought to his attention, but there's still stuff out there. sometimes a google search will turn up stuff the fray engine doesn't. just be sure to include the word, 'fray' in your search.

amen. 100% agree wit dat.
by catnapping
Re: Some of them are from the old fray...
by mom

Ah, so you're talking about old stuff in another context entirely.

I've read racist rants by obama supporters as well if you want to take the rants out of context.

I'm not sure he can do it.
by Archaeopteryx
You're right to say that offering Hillary the #2 spot would be the best thing for the party. Unfortunately, I'm not sure it's the best thing for a potential President Obama. I think she'd be perfectly capable of being the good, supportive VP. I'm just not sure she's going to want to do it, or would do it if offered. You know, there's a difference between being Assistant Regional Manager, and assistant to the Regional Manager.
"out of context?"
by catnapping

racism is never out of context.

nice try. rofl

Super delegates are a firewall?
by OneEyedJasper

No, demo. They're not.

Super delegates serve an important purpose—they’re a firewall. They are there to ensure that the Democratic party doesn’t drive off a cliff in their enthusiasm by nominating an unelectable candidate

An "unelectable candidate" being one that's just too darn liberal. In other words, super delegates are there to usurp the will of the voters. If the citizens want an very liberal candidate for the democratic nomination for president it is the super delegates solemn duty to crush that desire and disenfranchise those voters who wanted said liberal candidate.

It is the super delegates' responsibility to render an UNdemocratic decision at the convention if the will of the people gets too liberal.

"Firewall" is a euphemism. Super delegates are meant to usurp a democratic process. Way to go dems.

Re: "out of context?"
by mom

Really? Try this one:

<link>

This guy is one of the most ardent of Obama supporters...not to say most articulate.

To simplify and cut down on mouse clicks for you
by mom

Re: macrol is correct
by belezabub

05/02/2008, 12:42 PM

why aren't you blaming the immigrants themseleves.

they created the problem by over breeding and creatinga lot of unkempt unwash ignnorant cantolic and now baptist fools that came here to be bottom feeders and parasites.

the govenments didn't do that the goddamn spics did that.

Page 1 of 10 (149 items)   1 2 3 4 5 Next > ... Last »
View as RSS news feed in XML