We all know the type. The guy at a party who so desperately feels the need to impress upon you exactly how sophisticated he is, and what a bumpkin you are by comparison. He's the one who just insists that the particular vintage of Bordeaux he is drinking is unmistakably the finest of its variety in existence, and that the solid majority of wine drinkers who dislike it on first try are simply philistines cursed with unrefined palates. He is the one who affects a taste for escargot, to the visible disgust of the less cosmopolitan members of the dinner party. When questioned, he reverts to the old defense that it is an "acquired taste," although in this case it is always said with an air of mild superiority - even as the telltale glimmer of a pucker appears at the corner of his mouth as he takes another bite.

It would seem Jody Rosen is now fitting herself into that category. She is right on the money in naming Mariah Carey's true musical legacy, one that inspires anything ranging from mild annoyance to utter revulsion among real singers and musicians (the Curse of the Proliferating Melismata). But then, with the traces of her own dislike still peeking through here and there, she tries to convince the rest of us that Carey really does deserve her place in the musical pantheon - if only because of the pervasiveness of her influence. She even uses the same language of the escargot connoisseur ("I have learned to like it," or something to that effect) to tell the rest of us to eat our brussels sprouts and like Mariah Carey.

Well, I've got news for you. Brussels sprouts still taste bad to most people, and that is not any reflection upon the quality of those people's palates. And Mariah Carey still just plain sucks.

Wasn't Whitney Houston practicing this annoying singing style before Mariah Carey came around? I'd site an example, but honestly I can't stomach subjecting myself to the research. There must be others.

I hate to point this out, but so was Stevie Wonder, who should probably be included on that list with Elvis, the Beatles, Brown, and Dylan (where are the Stones? Bowie? Aretha Franklin? why do these lists exist save to be slapped with a promise on the cover of Rolling Stone as a way to prop up their ever-decreasing cache of musical relevance?)

While we hedge our evaluations on the quality of music based on broad appeal and the ability to stay alive for a long time while glimmering over the musical legacies of others, which is pretty much what everybosdy is trying to do (hello Eagles), we ignore the fact that disliking music doesn't make you a "hater."

If I were to be challenged every time I had to mention that I didn't like a certain band, I would stop talking about music altogether. Come to think of it, I am frequently challenged by this sort of transparent appeal to popular taste on a regular basis, and it has led me to be hesitant to talk about music at all, which is a shame, in that I have been a passionate music lover all my life.

Rather than correcting one another with arguments about a particular artist's place in some imaginary and counterintuitive canon, we might want to think once in a while about things we like. You know, that crazy part in the song where the singer makes a weird noise that is unlikely to ever be reproduced by another person (doesn't stop us all from trying), the period in which an album builds in passion and intensity to a point at which you almost feel ashamed to be privy to this sort of earnest emotion, the stretch that's so goddamn cool it's almost funny.

Would it kill us to even touch upon these things when we talk about music?

Good to see that Jody Rosen has joined Sasha Frere-Jones, Jess Harvell, Dominique Leone, and Mallory O'Donnell in the venerable club of Male Music Critics Who Get Mistaken for Women.

Much of what you say makes perfect sense, and does describe the attitudes of music critics far and wide, but I have to take issue with your central point, that Mariah Carey "sucks."

Look, nobody hates contemporary urban music much more than I do, especially the melismatic hordes of Mariah wannabes that infest American Idol, not to mention the airwaves. But it's not really fair to blame her for the imitators, especially when (as is mentioned downthread), Whitney was doing it first, and Stevie Wonder long before. Did Eric Clapton, Jimi Page and Eddie Van Halen "suck" because they influenced two generations of idiotic guitar wankers with faster fingers than brains? I would say, no.

And while I certainly don't think Mariah's creative talent or importance is in a league with these people she shares sales records with, let's save outright pejorative terms like "sucks" for people like Britney or New Kids On The Block. At least the woman writes or co-writes her own songs, and has done it well enough to last for well over a decade on the charts. No, I'm not suggesting that sales necessarily equate to quality, but consistent sales over a period of years do tend to equate to, at least, competance and a certain amount of talent.

Beyond this, at least give the woman credit for some impressive lungs.

One other thing, on the personality front. While she does seem to revel in playing the diva, I do sense a genuine humility in her at least on some level, unlike some other divas I could mention, like Alicia Keys.

I don't know if Mariah Carey is as important as Elvis but I do know that people love her and that she has been smart enough and hard-working enough to stay relevant in the music industry for almost 20 years. She deserves respect. I don't think there is any way in which anybody can deny her influence and success, It's too big. You have to acknowledge that, no matter how much you hate her music. It's not like people are suddenly taking Elvis' merits away.

Figures speak for themselves, Carey is relevant.

sawbones:

It sounds like Jazz Festival next year in NO. Count me in and my present wife. :) My only wife? Just met a person of the same caliber you so aptly described in Jody Rosen.

Not much of a palate for escargot; but, I like most other things or I think I do. And Mariah, and Mariah? Been listening to a lot of Blues, Jazz, and Swing. Maybe in fifty years I will acquire a taste for Mariah in my next life.

Cool post.

This hater begs to clarify--it's not the melisma, it's not the tacky persona, it's the tone of her voice--I hate her screechy caterwauling, all five octaves of it, and I know I'm not alone.

Momma:

I think sawbones would agree with you. As for me . . . both sawbones and I talked about the NO Jazz Festival. I am ready now!

Thanks for the response lady.

Gregorian monks did melisma as well So maybe we should credit them instead of Mariah Carey for bringing it to modern popular music. The point is that Mariah's particular twist on it and marrying it with R&B and hip hop was something new. The "Fantasy" collaboration with ODB may be the most influential song since Run-DMC heard Aerosmith practicing in the studio next door. Virtually every pop songstress now has song with rapper on it - vice versa.

Mariah is a tremendous talent - you don't have to like her, but don't hate.

Let me know which weekend you'll be there, as I don't know if we'll be able to get vacation time for both.

And I hope this isn't heresy, but you might need to alter your drink of choice when eating crawfish. The saying goes, you know you're eating crawfish done right when you can't tell the tears from the sweat from the snot. I'm thinking beer is going to be better than bourbon for cooling that off.

You're right - that was lazy writing. The word "suck" should definitely be reserved for the true purveyors of suckitude like the ones you cited. As for personality, I can't really say anything about it - I'm skeptical of our ability to really know the personalities of people we only know by how they are presented in mass media.

Dead on. You nailed it. Reading the article was a cringing experience. Reminded me of this "Friends" episode where some of the characters went to a "Hootie and the Blowfish" concert and then went backstage... and it was treated by the show as a wonderful thing. Hello! It's Hootie and the Blowfish for crying out loud. That's when I realized the show wasn't all it was cracked up to be.

Just why is it that people hate on Hootie so bad? What did Darius and the boys ever do to you?

They made some pleasant pop music that never broke ground or amazed anybody, but then, they never claimed to be anything more than a college town bar band that achieved some unexpected success.

Must everyone be a genius to avoid being tagged as "sucking"?

BTW, even if I'm pretty indifferent to their music and don't own any of their albums, I do think that Darius had one of the truly unique voices on radio within the last couple of decades. Give credit where it's due, even if it's grudging.

. . . it seems to me that this is more the guy who wants to impress you with how egalitarian he is, the guy who tries to wax academic on the merits of Seventh Heaven and Baywatch. The anti-elitist elitist, if you will (and probably even if you won't).

The escargot guy . . . that's me. I admit it freely. You have only my word that I actually like stuff like Jesu and the Eternals (I could possibly prove the latter by dancing to it, but since all you can really do with the former is close your eyes and let the rumble wash over you, rapture is likely to resemble the affectation thereof).

No, this article on Carey seems more to me like the "enlightened" dismissals of Ingmar Bergman that followed his death. There's a whole movement in criticism that reminds me of Ellsworth Toohey in The Fountainhead (no, I'm not a fan or follower of Rand, not an objectivist; I read her work when I was 18, which is about when her level of artistry and philosophical integrity has relevance), in which snobbery is employed in defense of the tastes of the average Steve (Joe having become a rare enough name to appear effete).

In the interest of full disclosure, I like brussel sprouts fine, but I prefer kale, chard, collard/mustard greens and the like. Cabbage is for salads and stir fries. I've never tried escargot, but I'll try anything once if the opportunity arises (in case I did it wrong the first time). My favorite things to eat are pho and a good cheeseburger. Not at the same meal, of course. I don't smoke THAT much pot.

Mariah Carey can sing, no question. I admire technical prowess, and she's got it. Of course, I wouldn't say I value technical prowess; as a fan of postpunk aesthetics, I'm more interested in concepts, storytelling, theatricality. In these aspects, I find her lacking. I've probably said that she sucks, and probably will again, but I don't know that I entirely mean that. What I really mean is, she bores me. Her music isn't that interesting; I suppose if we broaden our idea of "influence," she's had some, but she hasn't brought anything new to the dialogue.

Just my $0.02 (and whatever lint was still in that pocket).