...though more in the sense of confounding them than with stump speeches.

Obama, Clinton Face Deep Questions on God, Bible

Notable for not being present at this 'Compassion Forum' on faith issues: John McCain, scion of the value-voting Republican party. At least they mixed in some tough questions, as seen first with Hillary.

At first, Clinton seemed taken aback by the unexpected question of why a loving God would allow good people to suffer, before remarking that the question is the “subject of generations of commentary and debate.”

She then quipped, “I don’t know. I can’t wait to ask Him,” drawing applause from the crowd.

Now, the comments on the next page of the article were spot on, even if they were quite amusing for it. If Hillary gets the chance to ask this question, she'll most likely get back 'hey, I'm God! Who are you to ask me? Get to the worshipping and make it snappy.' They only object to judging god when the judgment doesn't go so well...

Meanwhile, Barack took the stage to call himself a devout xian and get wishy-washy about the creation story. I found his comments vague, as platitudes should be. It's 'fundamentally' true. It's true on some level, but you can't explain it? OTOH, at least he finds some way to reconcile the bible with evolution, thus proving the point (again) that only extremists see the evolution debate as an all-or-nothing fight to the death.

Obama also answered a question about the creation story in the Book of Genesis. He said he understands there is a debate about whether the universe was created in six days literally or not. The man running to be the first black U.S. president said he does not believe that the universe was created in 24 hour day periods although he believes the Bible’s creation story is “fundamentally” true. He also added that he believes in evolution and that it is not incompatible with the Christian faith. Rather, as he knows more about science it strengthens his faith.

And as with all things lately, McCain gets a pass, both from the commentators and from his own party. Now that he's the presumptive nominee, I guess he has nothing to prove to the religious right. Of course, he may be presiding over the fragmentation of the evangelical vote. Perhaps he sees it as a lost cause.

Commentators after the faith forum noted how far the Democrats have gone in addressing religion and politics, which had formerly been monopolized by the Republican Party. They also observed that evangelicals have changed and are broadening their issues beyond abortion and traditional marriage to include Darfur, torture, HIV/AIDS, climate change, and poverty.

Or, as they put it in the Matrix...

Neo: Why do my eyes hurt?
Morpheus: You've never used them before.

I'd like to retain a small shred of hope for my country and watching the two Democratic candidates for President happily kiss the ass of ignorant superstition, even in so cynical a ploy for votes, would rob me of that.

I feel your pain. And yet, seeing the subject of religion and faith, which has for so long been marketed as unassailable in its sincerity, being used against those who propagated that message and are now victims of their own success...it helps.

thats exactly what it was although I think Obama can play this game as well as the ole Gipper himself. I stand in awe of Obama at this point, his rhetorical skills are better than Bill Clinton at this age. By the time Obama gets to his mid-fifties, he will end up being the grand master of political rhetoric in our time. His faith appears to be genuine, one does not sit through 20 years of Wrights sermons just to shore up a resume. I think he wants to believe in God just like all the other religious folks around the world. I also think he would not be that shocked if he found out God did not exist. I think he uses his faith as a tool to live by, that is the best use of it that I have found. There are better tools though but everyone should be free to do as they wish.

...the Fighting Words today is actually one I can agree with? Man, I thought for sure Hitch would complain about the church not backing the war in Iraq. But he brings up Cardinal Law. Have to mark my calendar for this one, I almost never find myself in agreement with the fellow.

...that this "faith forum" involved anything but Christianity, either. ARe there no Jews, Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists, Shintoists, Wiccans, or other believers in America? Are their faiths not as valid? Should not the candidates be quizzed on these faiths?

What about asking whether one's religious beliefs have anything to do with one's fitness for office, especially given the prohibition in the Constitution of ANY 'religious test' for public office?

Sounds kinda lame and self-serving, to me...

as can be proved by reading the fray, most christians in this country think that their religion is most important and care little about the rights of others in general. so no surprise that this faith forum supported that.

It should be a non-issue. but, again, Christians WANT it to be an issue and keep making it one. It would be another groundbreaker if this country was able to elect (hell, even nominate) someone from a non-Christian background- esp. as POTUS.