Is Dickerson insane? Every day Hillary's chances to win by popular votes and delegates is diminishing. This month she had at least 60 superdelegates she once counted on openly break for Obama. Her two latest wins in Ohio and Texas were a lot smaller math-wise than she of course would let anyone know, especially as Obama won the Texas caucuses handily.

Richardson's endorsement of Obama is clearly a pointed way to say, "Hillary is toast; I want to be Obama's Veep."

It's all basically over for Hillary but the shouting; and the Clinton's slash and burn tactics; and Hillary's exagerrations about her "experience"; and the Clintonian lying; and the Clinton's campaign's dismissal of Obama as being nothing but a black candidate; and the Clintons' refusal to release their tax returns; and the endless daily shots and sniping which pick apart, reduce, exhaust, hurt, bruise and distract Obama - the only likely Democratic candidate - when he should be focusing on McCain.

Every day that Hillary remains on her sick, obsessive, selfish and Quixotic quest for presidential power, she divides Democrats and Dem-leaning independents and weakens the entire ticket, even if she pulls a cat out of her hat and gets the nomination.

Every day she refuses to acknowledge that she has lost the nomination she makes McCain stronger.

She and Billy Boy, being sociopathic egomaniacs, truly sick individuals, are destroying their own party out of their selfishness.

The only silver lining would be if Shrill Hill ends up putting McCain in the presidency, she and Golden Billy will be hated by the Democratic Party as they deserve to be, and she will finally divorce Bill and get their relationship above board, and they will be pariahs among Democrats, something they couldn't bear. Maybe they would just go away to Peru or something.

Seriously, I can not stress this enough: these sort of comments are turning people off of Obama. Attack her on substance all you want, that's fine, and there is much to be attacked. But using Republican slurs and attacking their marriage at the end, it has to stop.

I was certainly nasty and personal, but let's face it. They are indeed doing everything that I stated. They are risking throwing the entire thing to McCain by staying in it way past their bedtime. They must be stopped.

supporters what's what. That's sure to convince them to vote for Obama if Hillary should withdraw from the race. I mean just because you sound EXACTLY like Rush Limbaugh at his most virulent in his Clinton hating mode is NO reason that HR Clinton voters shouldn't vote for Obama who's going to change the way that politics is run in America.

Yep . . . ummmm . . . well . . . maybe not.

night_man:

Seriously, I can not stress this enough: these sort of comments are turning people off of Obama. Attack her on substance all you want, that's fine, and there is much to be attacked. But using Republican slurs and attacking their marriage at the end, it has to stop.

Do you pay much attention to the tactics employed by the Clinton campaign and supporters?

For some reason Clinton supporters like to claim the moral high ground, while simultaneously ignoring the facts about the strategy the Clintons are using.

They've run a deplorably deceptive and vitriolic campaign; all the while playing the victim card. And people eat that shit up. I am at a loss.

night_man:

Seriously, I can not stress this enough: these sort of comments are turning people off of Obama. Attack her on substance all you want, that's fine, and there is much to be attacked. But using Republican slurs and attacking their marriage at the end, it has to stop.

I understand your point about civil discourse, which is Obama's angle, but a substance-style attack against the Clintons is one that would honestly question their character.

They *do* have a very, very, very long history of scandals, abuses of power, and outright lying.

"Dodging snipers in Bosnia?" I mean, seriously, that's classic Clinton; a baldfaced lie told so convincingly that people buy it and when confronted with the undeniable truth another lie is told "and can we please move on now???"

You don't forget sniper fire. Do the Clintons think people are really that stupid and easily fooled? She was getting flowers from a little girl, for cying out loud.

That's what bothers me about a lot of your hardcore Clinton supporters; when you bring this up, they ignore it, accuse you of sexism, being part of "the vast right wing conspiracy" ect. trying to make *you* look like the jackass for bringing it up, not the Clintons for being caught in a lie.

As for their marriage, in the USA we're not too big on political marriages ala' something out of the Hapsburg Dynasty. Their marriage also brings up issues about their character.

He *has* had multiple mistresses and she's helped cover them up? Why? Either she's weak and cowed by him, or something more cynical; mayby she needs him?

I think she's using him as her meal ticket to political power and will endure this humiliation, hell even use and play off of it, to get sympathy and get power.

That type of icy, soulless cyniscism really jarrs me; allowing your spouse to fool around on you for power.

The manipulative way she embraces perpetual victimhood for sympathy votes is disgusting and even some Slate writers see this.

Some people are suprised, for instance, why she continues to run when Obama is 99% likely to get the nomination, why doesn't she realize that she's hurting and dividing the party by doing so?

However, when you get the Clintons, when you get that it's all about them you're not suprised.

Dickerson's thesis holds a little water only until you realize that Hillary is mathematically eliminated from this campaign. She can't possibly pass Obama's delegate or vote totals. So at this point, ANY attack by the Clinton campaign on Obama is gratuitous and corrosive. Overreactions by Obama's surrogates in this light are understandable, because she is no longer a credible candidate. At this point, she is no more than a traitor to her party. Had she dropped out after losing the Potomac primaries, she could now be Obama's running mate, or his SecDef, or whatever she wanted. But her ten years of planning notwithstanding, she cannot be president, at least in 2009. If, however, she fatally damages Obama's candidacy, maybe she can run again four years hence. That thought should frighten us all.

I've never really seen HRC claiming victimhood other than her legitimate complaints about biased press coverage (until it was lampooned merciliously on SNL).

The original poster reinforces the point of that Obama supporters are keen to take the conventional wisdom to heart and use smear tactics (right-wing talking points about the Clintons) if it supports their purposes while claiming to be above dirty politics. This hypocrisy can also be seen in the claims of victory in the TX caucus being valid but superdelegates in the convention invalid.

Absolutely

No, the right wing WANTS Hillary to stick around, to continue to damage Obama. They want her to stick around to see if in fact she has a chance to get the nomination, so the right wing can destroy her and get McCain in. She's doing exactly what they want her to do.

Please tell me where I am wrong about what the Clintons are doing to the Democrats' chances for the general.

An honest attack on the Clintons' character, which they daily prove to be poor, is not an attack on their supporters. I always wonder how they have hoodwinked so many Democrats, but that's their talent.

Nonetheless, pointing out that obvious that she has a very slim chance to win the nomination but continues to fight on and hurt the entire Party, is not an attack on her supporters.

I'd like to hear how you disagree with my take on what she's doing to both her and Obama's chances of winning.

I am very concerned that we will end up with John McCain as president of Hillary doesn't accept the facts that she has lost the nomination short of a hijacking by the Democratic superdelegates.

I have enormous respect for McCain, and he could be a welcome change from the Bible thumping wing of the Republican Party. He may actually even spend less than Bush (who couldn't?). But my biggest concerns about him however is that he's too hawkish, too willing to stay in this already lost war in Iraq, too likely to get into an unnecessary war against Iran, generally too reactive.

I also think he wouldn't be a good manager of people. What makes him interesting - his temper, independent streak and all that - can also make him poorly suited for executive leadership.

Then the best strategy - since attacking Hillary Clinton and her supporters only makes them dig in - is to simply go on with the campaign, positively, and not contribute to destroying the Democratic party. Stop pointing out mistakes and lies and inevitablilities. The voters will judge for themselves. If they see Obama's support listen to his message and stop sniping and attacking, then they will see Obama as more trustworthy. If we choose not to engage, the Clinton campaign will just become noise people don't want to listen to after. They will look at the endless harping from one side only and see which way is the right way to go. Sure, they can win a few votes by throwing in 3am phonecall ads, but these are only short term strategies that lose effectiveness over time. The best thing to do is just ignore them, praise both candidates and relax. Obama truly is a star - let him shine. This election will be a breeze once we decide to control our own reactions to the opposition.

Obama '08

night_man:

Seriously, I can not stress this enough: these sort of comments are turning people off of Obama. Attack her on substance all you want, that's fine, and there is much to be attacked. But using Republican slurs and attacking their marriage at the end, it has to stop.

I agree. I am a die-hard Obama supporter, so die-hard that I fight for him here even though I'm Canadian! I know it's hard to resist the temptation of attacking, especially when attacked, but I can see it for what it is - and endless cycle of bickering that leads to one more election decided by fear, anger, and greed.

Nothing will make Hillary Clinton end her campaign or her negative attacks except Hillary Clinton. Why drive ourselves nuts trying to stop her? Her supporters will fight right along with her right to the bitter end. She said herself that she is a scapper, so lets stop playing to her strengths by trying to scrap back. Don't give her anything to defend against, and all Democrats will see is someone who can't stop fighting. Obama's strenght is his positive, uniting message, which is lost any time we take shots at her. If you really want to help Obama win, tell other Obama supporters to cool it. It's his Presidential bid, and he must fight his own battles the way he wants to.

Obama '08

Outrager: Dickerson's thesis holds a little water only until you realize that Hillary is mathematically eliminated from this campaign. She can't possibly pass Obama's delegate or vote totals..

The real corollary to this is that any fighting back now by Obama's side is a pointless waste of energy. We can only damage ourselves at this point and feed the Clinton camp's determination. So why risk it all for the sake of taking self-righteous cheap shots?

Don't let fear, anger, and bragging blow it all now. You won't ever convince them it is lost, they have to come to it on their own. Without anyone engaging them, her campaign will run out of steam. Fight back and we only incite them more while making ourselves less noble in the process. Have confidence in your candidate's ability to win this despite anything Clinton does. If we can have the discipline to do that, she will only damage herself. Let them all flail away while we stay cool. Then Obama can be heard, and let's face it people like it when he talks, but not so much when others try to talk for him. We can have the high ground all to ourselves, and that will be the key to our victory here. Stay steadfast, keep faith, believe in change.

Obama '08