To me, the mind-numbing part to it is the sheer volume of miracles JV-12 cites. Not only do we have to deal with bleeding statues, or reports of faith healings and the like, but they're endless. I could debunk one after another for the rest of my natural life, and he could go one offering example after example -- and at no point does any of this debunking shake him whatsoever.

I agree with you two here; these are poor quality miracles if their purpose is in part to convince people to convert. Since we've been asked before what would be convincing, I've been pondering what I think a sufficient miracle would be for that purpose, and I wonder if anyone else has an opinion on the subject.

In trying to identify particular qualities that would be helpful in demonstrating the reality of a particular god-concept, I think that such a 'religious experience' ought to be shared by everyone, everywhere, not just the lucky few at some particular site; recordable, so that it can't be easily dismissed; repeatable, so that it doesn't happen once and leave those who missed it guessing; and should have a clear message, not be just some manifestation that has to be interpreted.

What would the world be like, I wonder? If instead of going to church to have some old man read from a book about his interpretation of god's will -- instead, the sun dances in the sky every Sunday morning, and god reviews the past week in the world with each of us.

I realize that the first objection out of the gate is free will, that we supposedly don't have a free choice if it's this obvious -- but at the same time, JV-12 at least insists that it is this obvious, that the miracles he cites make it obvious to him. So I'm setting that objection aside for the moment.