Ever see a good-looking man? Can you appreciate that a guy is good-looking, but not want to have sex with him?

Maybe. But as a happily married bisexual, I sort of doubt it. Can't speak for TJA on this.

For that matter, how about a beautiful horse?

I think all appreciation of beauty has an element of the erotic to it, and some element of possession (though which side is possessing and which possessed can vary). I can't help but think that some part of me, deep down, says, "What a beautiful sunset. I wonder how hard I can make it come?"

;^)

I'm being deliberately churlish, Fitz. I liked your top post, even if, like TJA, I have a somewhat less optimistic view than you do of the internal motivations of this beast we call human. And I've been married and faithful for nigh 12 years, so . . . well, something seems to be working, right?

I agree with you, and with TJA, that temptation is very real, and, for most people, fraught with ongoing struggle. On the other hand, I don't think it's JUST lack of opportunity or fear of being caught that keeps me from acting on it. I have moral and ethical convictions that prevent me, as well, much in my marriage that I hold sacred. I suppose "limiting opportunities" is a reasonable enough approach, but between maintaining friendships and working onstage, I'm inevitably going to find myself in emotionally and erotically "charged" situations; how I ACT in those situations becomes a measure of my character.

Imagine that this aspect were no longer there - she gives you permission, won't be hurt - would you then have sex with someone else?

Assuming that she's sincere, well, that'd be an open marriage. Given that, I'm inclined to say that if I and a prospective partner were willing, well, yeah, why not? I mean, we have to decide each case on its merits, but in principle, you can't tell someone the door is always open and then be surprised when they go outside.

But that's not the kind of marriage I have, not the kind I asked for, and certainly not the kind I'm gonna spring on my lovely wife after the fact.

thelyamhound:

I'm being deliberately churlish, Fitz. I liked your top post, even if, like TJA, I have a somewhat less optimistic view than you do of the internal motivations of this beast we call human. And I've been married and faithful for nigh 12 years, so . . . well, something seems to be working, right?

Thanks for the response. Yes, something must be working. What is it? Do you struggle mightily, but rest secure in your strength to overcome temptation? Or do you wallow in despair, like Weiss, knowing that an affair is inevitable, and rail against the velvet bars of your self-elected prison?

Meanwhile, is your mother beautiful?

Finally, I make no claims to understand humans as a whole, except that I know that universal statements (like Weiss's) are nearly universally wrong.

Do you struggle mightily, but rest secure in your strength to overcome temptation? Or do you wallow in despair, like Weiss, knowing that an affair is inevitable, and rail against the velvet bars of your self-elected prison?

More like the former than like the latter, definitely. I can't imagine why I would get or stay married if it were the latter. But there are struggles, of course, and compromises I have to constantly weigh in my mind; having sex with other women is the least of my worries.

Meanwhile, is your mother beautiful?

Well, of course. :) But not physically, no. I take your point--that it's POSSIBLE to experience physical beauty divorced from erotic impulse. And I'm not really convinced that either of us is right, since under most circumstances, these theories will remain (thankfully) untested. What I would say is that it's quite possible that one who did find one's mother--or cousin, or aunt (just to make it a little less . . . icky)--to be physically attractive might well be fielding a genuine erotic temptation, but refrains (easily or otherwise, depending on temperament, character, etc.) due to social pressures, self-discipline, etc.

OR . . . The chemical framework of the human animal provides natural revulsion to any would-be desire to possess immediate family erotically, thereby differentiating mother, in your example, from OTHER other women.

It's all theory, anyway, which is why I suggest that we ought be judged on action rather than volition.

"Myself, I've never had much interest in casual sex. My partner needs to appeal on many different levels, not just the physical, to be interesting."

Yeah, casual sex really loses it's appeal after a few decades.