eljay:

I am so glad someone finally used the word "grace." If there is one glaring difference among all religions/cults, it is that Christianity is the only one to offer grace for those who would open their hearts to it. Tithing is not required for grace, nor any special classes or secret knowledge. Yes, there have been and continue to be horrible acts done in the name of God, but that can never disount the fact, and actually only points to the fact, that we are ALL fallen and desperately in need of God's grace.

I refute your assertion that we are fallen. We are what we are and have always been so. I do not want to live in the perfect world that people like yourself visualize in your minds. What would we do in such a world? I suppose that we could sit around, never cold or hungry, wanting and needing nothing, bragging to one another about how wonderful this unchanging, perfect world is. Frozen in time in a perfect state of perfection.

Fuck that!

Sorry, but if you read the ending of chapter four you see that they all made the covenant that all things would be devided evenly. They all sold their houses and lands and gave the money to the apostles, with Barnabas given as the example. When Ananias sold and gave only part he was breaking the covenant that he had sworn to give all to the apostles for the common fund. In was in holding back the portion that the covenant was broken, and why he and his wife were killed, not because they tried to lie about it.

Geez, where did you find this dusty old thread. If any of the original posters have not already died of old age, they have probably long ago forgotten whatever it was they were trying to say. LOL

Dusty old threads are fun. You blow the dust away and get a surprise underneath.

That can be true, but as I have no fond memories of the original Scientology discussions, I have little enthusiasm for seeing them resurrected.

I thought we were discussing Mormonism. See how interesting the dust can be.

Well, it was originally about Scientology, but if you want to discuss Mormonism instead, that is fine with me.

We had a rather unpleasant round last summer when Slate published a less than flattering article on Scientology and every one of their English-speaking members on the entire planet spammed the board for about a week or so! Not interested in a repeat of that.

Acts 5:3 But Peter said, Ananias, why hath Satan filled thine heart to lie to the Holy Ghost, and to keep back part of the price of the land? 4 Whiles it remained, was it not thine own? and after it was sold, was it not in thine own power? why hast thou conceived this thing in thine heart? thou hast not lied unto men, but unto God. 5 And Ananias hearing these words fell down, and gave up the ghost: and great fear came on all them that heard these things.

Pretty straigth forward....it was the lies to the Holy Ghost and to God.

While, yes the lie was the final blow that got the Guy killed, he was lieing about giving all the money he promised. The sin was in trying to hide this previous sin.

Malachi 3: 8-10

Will a man rob God? Yet ye have robbed me. But ye say, Wherein have we robbed thee? In tithes and offerings. Ye are cursed with a curse: for ye have robbed me, even this whole nation. Bring ye all the tithes into the storehouse, that there may be meat in mine house, and prove me now herewith, saith the Lord of hosts, if I will not open you the windows of heaven, and pour you out a blessing, that there shall not be room enough to receive it.

Ananias was robbing God in not giving the full amount. He topped this off with lieing about it, so he was struck dead, as was his wife. The lie was not the first sin, it was simply the kicker.

shematwater:

Dusty old threads are fun. You blow the dust away and get a surprise underneath.

What surprise? Scientology is not a religion because L Ron Hubbard was a mediocre pulp science fiction writer, and THAT IS ALL.

---Wrenn.

(And you can ask anyone in the east coast science fiction community for the past 20 years, who the hell 'Wrenn' is.)

;-)

LOL…There you go back peddling.....

What are you talking about?

Quoting you typos and all….

“In was in holding back the portion that the covenant was broken, and why he and his wife were killed, not because they tried to lie about it”.

Emphases mine…

And now

“While, yes the lie was the final blow that got the Guy killed,”

I have reread my posts, and will appologize. I did state that it was not the lieing that got him killed.

I conceded that it was the lie that got him killed, but that does not make with holding the money any less of a crime against God.

I just went back and reread the account (in the KJV, so perhaps the translation is misleading) but this does not seen to have anything at all to do with tithing -- it seems clear that it was a voluntary act to sell their property and donate it to the commune -- and that it WAS only the fact that they lied about holding back some of the proceeds that was at issue.

5:4 Whiles it remained, was it not thine own? and after it was sold, was it not in thine own power? why hast thou conceived this thing in thine heart? thou hast not lied unto men, but unto God.